Ukraine

Anti-government protests in Ukraine
Balls.

Lots of them.

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Backgrounder Wiki; see also these Beeb pieces and this National Post update.

Ukraine Protest

And pay attention to Guerrillamerica’s suggestion to use the Kyiv fighting as a real-world intel exercise.

Coming soon to a neighborhood near you.

47 responses to “Ukraine

  1. Too bad that they seem to be fighting for the wrong thing. (Inclusion in the EU)

    • If it’s that or getting swallowed by The Bear, the weaklings in Brussels look pretty sweet, IMHO.

      • The “Bear” would be preferable to the communists based in Brussels.
        Wow! Who’d have predicted that sentence in 1980?

        • Better?

          To Ukrainians?

          The Great Russian Bear, who has despised both Poles and Ukrainians for hundreds of years?

          State the bases for your conclusions, pls.

          • There’s a post I read elsewhere (will provide link later if I find it) describing how there’s an ethnic split among Ukrainians northwest versus southeast within the present borders, and how this impacts Ukrainian politics. For example, Galicia, which is presently within Ukraine, and was part of the Austria-Hungary Empire for a time, and part of Poland as well. One could make an argument that perhaps Ukraine should split, as what one half the country favors does not match what the other half prefers. There’s also a religious split Roman versus Orthodox. the whole thing’s a bloody mess.

            Galicia also played an “interesting” role in WW2 history I am not inclined to forget when contemplating attempts to “unite” Europe.

          • I’ll reply: the EU is run by Jewish and Jew-connected banksters. Same ethnicity that originated Russian communism, the Terror Famine, and all the rest. Ukraine needs to steer clear of both the EU and Putin. As for the paving bricks, tear gas, and cocktails, pretty neat…but a love-in compared to what is coming to the ‘Kwa.

        • Better yet is to go neither way. Why tie yourself to one empire or another? The Finns don’t do that.
          Anyway Guerillamerica’s article is excellent. Let’s ignore the political background, since it is typically idiotic, and concentrate on the rest.

          • That, I think, is where the Ukrainian President is headed: independence with the benefit of some alliance. The problem, I think, is that neither the Rus nor the Poles much appreciate Kiev’s fence straddling.

        • Jimmy the Saint

          “The “Bear” would be preferable to the communists based in Brussels.”

          Like Hell. During the 80s, I went to the Soviet Union as part of a student exchange. As part of our program, they took us on a tour of the USSR, and one of the stops was Kiev. As part of the stop in Kiev, we got taken by bus out to a monument – the Monument To Russian/Ukrainian Friendship. Our guide was Ukrainian. He explained that he was one of the only Ukrainians who ever visited the monument, and he only did because he had to take tour groups there. The other ones who did were fellow guides and people looking for a place to piss.

  2. From the Wikipedia page:

    “…Notably, the protests have remained entirely directed at the regime, without a single store-front window broken in Kiev’s downtown in two months of protests, contrary to civil unrest in other European nations such as Greece, Spain, Italy, Portugal and France.[74]..”

    These guys get it. Don’t piss off the people you are looking to for support.

  3. If anyone’s interested, we could spin up a forum linked off Guerrillamerica, to record and task intelligence requirements. I could spend a couple hours a day updating the map (or just have someone else do it for practice – or have EVERYONE do it for practice) based on information we’ve verified, or that has been corroborated by multiple sources. Any takers?

  4. Hardcore man!

  5. After what was done to the Ukranian people more than 80 years ago, they are NOT going to go down without a fight.

  6. True Udaman but they most definitely not fighting for freedom they are fighting to become slaves of the EU. They are seriously misguided.

  7. RobRoySimmons

    Anything to the Mex militias that Zerohedge has a story up?

  8. timing picked to olympics.

    the bear is somewhat restrained until end of Feb. Gains must be consolidated before gloves come off.

    they picked the timing.
    lets watch the plans unravel.

  9. Retards. WTF wants to join the queer-loving, future Islamic EU which is broke?

    Russia actually looks like it is the only sane nation left on the planet.

  10. The Russians should shoot anyone with a Molotov. Problem solved.

    I love how the EU/NATO is screwing over Russia for cock-blocking NATO in Syria.

    Payback, oh Eurotrash, will be a bitch.

  11. I think this video should have Leslie Fish’s song “Black Powder and Alcohol” as a musical accompaniment. o_O

  12. Just my conjecture here, but I don’t think this is picking Brussels over Moscow. The economy in Ukraine sucks as it does in Russia, and the people in Ukraine are desperate for work. Many are here in the US working for low wages, to support their family at home. Some think Europe is their salvation, and what might seem as crap to us here: cleaning toilets in France and Scandinavia, is a chance for better life to those in Ukraine. It’s a temporary, but they’re not very particular about that at this time. Anyway, they’re desperate and have little to lose. The Ukranian president is a criminal thug and after he ordered student protesters to be beaten, the locals started to fight back.

    What is most significant to me about these events is the fact that so many employed by this government are so ready to carry out violence against their neighbors on behalf of a petty criminal. They are ready to enforce his temper tantrums.

    Now reflect on our own country and the way park rangers behaved recently. How close were they to beat the veterans over the head with clubs if ordered to do so? Another point that should concern us here, is that the government folks in Ukraine and Russia are more competent and more serious than the people currently running our government. Our thugs are just as likely to throw tantrums and they have lots of ready enforcers here. As soon as the money runs out, or as soon as people realize that the money has run out, we will turn just as desperate here.

  13. I concur Yanuk is a thug, but what folks don’t understand is that even the Kremlin doesn’t like the SOB. He doesn’t stay bought, like most Ukrainian politicians.

    “The Russians should shoot anyone with a Molotov. Problem solved.” Throwing Molotov cocktail missiles without live ammo on the insurgent side as fire support only ‘works’ if the cops are quasi-restrained and willing to sit there and wait for the fire extinguisher, like in Ukraine in these scenes or in Greece in many others. (Not that the Berkut haven’t been beating the crap out of journalists and other civilians they’ve caught, but the street fighters are giving some of them as good as they’ve delivered with bloody Berkut images all over the place and cops screaming for the fire extinguishers or medics).

    In America we all know most of these Molotov cocktail throwers would be shot with either rubber bullets or live ammo on sight. As similar policy is very likely if the Berkut don’t fear retaliation against their homes and families which has already been threatened via public social media. Most likely due to that problem Yanuk will bring in mercs and the urban sniping will begin. If the Poles or Baltic states start smuggling in guns or explosives so the oppo can maintain armed resistance things could escalate very fast. Let’s just say while Jamie Kirchuk or the Washington Post editorial board may tacitly approve of arming a Western Ukrainian insurgency centered on Lvov (just like the Nazi collaborator Stepan Bandera’s movement) it won’t be their asses blown up by car bombs in Warsaw or Latvia, but the Polish or Latvian intelligence operatives involved in the gun running. Hell, maybe they even have enough weaponry left over from Libya to try and smuggle weapons from Syria into Ukraine from the Black Sea via Turkey.

    I concur with the commenters above — Ukraine is NOT going to be admitted to the EU club, there’s already enough competition for toilet scrubbing jobs from Poles and Romanians (and soon Greeks given how desperate their situation is becoming). But Yanuk failed to restrain the Berkut thugs and then compounded the error by throwing gasoline on a dying fire — the Maidan folks would’ve dispersed once they’d realized the EU cavalry weren’t coming and only a hardcore who were getting paid by (Soros/NRI/NED cough cough) NGOs to be there were sticking with it.

    My sympathies are certainly with ordinary people and I pray Ukraine can avoid a civil war that nobody’s really going to win (see Syria). We all can sympathize with ordinary folks exasperated by brutal cop assholes and unjust laws. Nonetheless, make no mistake gentlemen the ‘New World Order’ or whatever you want to call them would be quite happy to fight Putin to the last Ukrainian. Hopefully the hocklis are smart enough to realize that and not play the role of pawns for those who are still pissed about not getting their proxy war with Russia in Syria.

    • Interesting insight. Am I right to guess that you do this sort of assessment professionally? I would love an invitation to view your blog.

  14. Secession. It’s typically the answer.

    Vote with your feet. Everyone on Team Merkel shuffle in that direction. Everyone in Team Putin shuffle in the other direction.
    Each draw a line on the map and remember that the more ambitious it is the more blood and treasure you’ll lose chasing it.
    Get down to business.

    Or do it the collectivist way. “One size fits none.”

  15. ALCON: What happens in the Ukraine is not NATO’s, read FUSA’s, concern. Ukraine has no bearing on how one lives their life (or tries to) in FUSA.

    Better you folks put your energy on countering the escalating .gov tyranny here, in FUSA, than wasting your concerns on Ukraine.

  16. The scenario for the police reaction in the USSA would be quite different, the American constabulary would go to guns immediately and get away with it. I think the pressures of “popular” perception and the whispers of Army sympathy to the protesters is staying the trigger fingers of the Ukrainian cops but time will tell.

    Guerrillamerica is providing THE best coverage and analysis on this event.

    I am certain the new laws being hurried will have reverse effects on the outcome: The new laws allow the authorities to jail those who blockade public buildings for up to five years and permit the arrest of protesters who wear masks or helmets.

    Convenient that they can rush through these measures.

    The use of masks, hoodies and helmets goes a long way to foiling facial recognition software.

    The reaction to this in the USSA would be lethal and most of the slack-jawed television watchers would cheer the government supremacists.

    Bill Buppert

  17. Won’t see that here…

  18. If that was going on anywhere in the US, I don’t believe you’d see the police acting with restraint like these guys. I believe they’d open fire, both from the guys on the front line and from snipers positioned well behind the line. Officer safety being their primary reason for doing so. Hell they already open fire the second any officer feels threatened, whether justified or not, and get off scot-free.

    If ‘Assad is a war criminal’ for violently suppressing an attempted overthrow of his government by sunni wahabbists, what will the world call Obama (or insert your favorite puppet-in-chief) when (not if) he does the same?

    A million marchers in DC demanding Obama and Congress’ abdication would be met with full on violence and many would be killed. The government would say they were protecting Americans from terrorists.

    More power to those in Ukraine and in Mexico with the courage to resist the psychopaths.

  19. “Civil Disturbances” in the USSA seem to be more of a “left-wing” “Occupy Wall Street” nature. Mostly symbolic protest with some vandalism of business property. If it were to escalate beyond that, lethal force would be used and the average Amerikan would smile and nod approvingly. Because it’s OK to protest in your free speech zone, and vandalism is frowned upon but often silently tolerated, but God help you if you upset the status quo.

    On the bright side however is that the USSA is heading for an “Atlas Shrugged” style collapse. Now if it’ll only speed up a bit.

    • Sparks, there are major differences between the protesters in the US and those in Ukraine. First, the Ukraine protesters were not clueless OWS supported by Soros et al. I was very impressed with the comment by xxtwitter… , I am unconvinced that that protest was something Soros cooked up. Second, the economic situation in Ukraine is far worse than here. Young people get out of college and have no job prospects. Not like here where they have lousy job prospects and comfy lives in their parents’ homes. There they have no job prospects and no comfort at home. There are lots of young people with nothing to do and it is a very volatile situation. Third, the average Ukranian supports these protesters unlike the case in the US with OWS.

  20. RobRoySimmons

    See it from the Ukrainian speaking Ukrainians side, they were victims of the Soviet version of the Russian empires’s genocide in the 30s. They like the people in the Baltic Republics want to see the Russians gone.

  21. They got balls alright, and I wish them the best. Still, it’s a “calculus of loss.” Some choice—European communism or Russian communism. In their defense, a guy only knows what he knows.

    We know better. There’s a reason America led the world at everything for such a long time and we either get back to that, else all this is for naught. A commenter had a great line last week—The Cavalry HAS arrived; just go look in the mirror.

    Live free or die. That’s my plan.

  22. I can’t imagine that it would take multiple experiences of BEING ON FIRE to find another gig.

    It would seem the odds for protestors would be improved with – deliver accelerant first, then ignite – not the other way around. And large slingshots or pnuematic tube launchers could seriously improve the delivery range.

  23. The cops in the USA would undoubtedly answer molotov cocktails with gun fire given their penchant for doing so at even the slightest provocation, but remember, unlike the disarmed Ukrainians, the fired upon here in the US are likely to fire back.

  24. See those old dudes chucking rocks without any “riot gear”? Possibly a microcosm of the auxiliary. Guys who were just going to the market, maybe on their long trip home after dining at a cafe, or even heard what was going on outside and were fed up of decades of BS .gov

  25. With your permission, I submit this link:http://www.ustream.tv/channel/euromajdan
    You can watch the protests and standoff live.

  26. “Vote with your feet. Everyone on Team Merkel shuffle in that direction. Everyone in Team Putin shuffle in the other direction.” De facto partition even if the whole country is still called ‘Ukraine’ is the only outcome to avert bloodshed over the long haul at this point.

    Hell the Crimea is already technically autonomous under the Ukrainian Constitution — both the ethnic Russian majority, the Russian gov and the Crimean Tatars before the EU started plying them with euros all insisted on it back in 91′ when Ukraine became independent. Crimea like Kharkiv is majority Russian speaking. Lvov never wanted to be part of any Russophone polity so let them go their way in peace and become de facto part of the Polish empire again, if the Poles can stomach the Bandera parades.

    What isn’t making the Washington Post and other pro-Western Ukrainian papers over here is that before the Molotov cocktail and pavement catapulting the oppo party deputies physically assaulted Yanuk’s party deputies in the Rada and tried to prevent them from voting with fists. They ended up taking their vote with a show of hands because they couldn’t vote electronically due to the mayhem. Again, Yanuk is a crook but I don’t see too many good guys here besides the ordinary pissed off Ukrainian. The oppo pols including Klitschko are mostly on the Soros/NRI/NED (read: State Department) payroll.

  27. There are reports that significant portion of the military backs the protesters. That would be a very good reason for cop restraint.

  28. Look….the takeover of the USA was completed with the uncontitutional soetoro-obama in JAN 09. The bastard never qualified to be POTUS under Article 2, Section 1, Clause 5 of the US Constitution. Not one member of Congress has made effort to initiate criminal proceedings against him. Why not ?

    Look….at how soetoro-obama is issuing edicts with illegal executive orders. Congress is not challenging him. SCOTUS is supporting him. He has literally become a dictator.

    ALCON….the Constitution is dead and buried. The soft revolution of soetoro-obama and his fellow Marxists was completed 5 years ago. Now the consolidation of that success is being conducted, every day.

    I doubt there will ever be a concentrated and organized effort to “go to guns”.

    We are in deep shit.

  29. You really think you’re getting the whole story? How about the countless Ukrainians who want to ally with Russia – a far healthier nation that the EU or the United States. Have you all learned nothing from the Soros funded “color revolutions”?

    I remind you that our Media is Tribe owned. They’re not going to give you the other side. Why would they?