Two From Will Grigg

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Law-and-Order Leninism

Without “Qualified Immunity,” Would Cops Be So Quick to Kill?

If you really want to understand where you and your family stand as mere Mundanes today in FUSA, ask your friendly local neighborhood police officer the follow question:

Under what circumstances may a citizen use force (including deadly force where warranted) against a police officer?

Stand your ground.

Insist on an answer.

Note carefully the non-verbal communications coming from the officer as well.

Remember all of those results.

Use them in your planning process.

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22 responses to “Two From Will Grigg

  1. Col. Hans Landa

    Right to resist unlawful arrest.

    http://www.constitution.org/uslaw/defunlaw.htm

    • Col. Hans Landa

      In other words, you can beat the rap, AND the ride, if it’s an unlawful kidnapping and you can smoke the entire opposition that would be gunning for you. Most likely suicide.

      • In the beginning, people would be vastly outnumbered by the opposition, But Just as the pot laws break to accommodate the overwhelming number of law breaking users… when large majority of people are subjected to the same level of abuse, the opposition gunning for you, may find themselves the hunted instead of the hunters….

    • Plummer vs State (Indiana) is over 100 years old and should be compared to Sykes vs US (federal but originating from Indiana) from 2011.

  2. This goes beyond Leninism to full pick and choose doublethink for the oligarchy. Take Indiana for example. There is stand your ground against the cops law on the books, but do you think average Joe will ever get to use that as a defense? This is the same state where simply fleeing police is a violent felony and the SCOTUS has already backed them up on it.

    They really do expect you to just stand there and let yourself get shot even when they’re wrong. Until you wrap your head around that you won’t understand how deep in beast’s belly you already are.

  3. Not only is it going to take each of us individually to stand up, but it’s also going to take our friends, neighbors, and other liberty minded individuals with the balls to stand and back us up. We are powerful if we stand together.

  4. About two decades ago, I tested the waters and posed a similar line of questioning to my local sheriff. The body language was quite interesting; anger, belligerence, incredulous and indignant, come to mind and then, threatening bully tactics. It resulted in me becoming a marked man in that little jurisdiction. For the next decade I remained and endured harassment and false arrest.

    • Wow! Good for you. Very heroic on your part, piss poor performance by police on theirs.

      Thanks for your effort.

  5. The Col has it right. Stay away from them animals unless you’re ready to kill as many as possible. Or one at a time in private.

    • But make sure if you do the “one at a time in private” that you leave NOTHING identifiable to you anywhere near the event. And that especially includes videos or photos by traffic cameras or security cameras.

      One appropriate can or bottle, however…

  6. Alfred E. Neuman

    Reblogged this on The Lynler Report.

  7. I like the idea of having a few questions on hand to vet professed “good cops” as they present. I like your regards the right to resist. Here are a few others I’ve compiled.
    The best:
    “Do you believe that holding this position gives you the moral right to do anything that anyone else does not have the right to do?”

    If they were able to grasp the *significant weight and depth* of that question and were willing to humor me, I might throw out a few more (actually, I could come up with them all day long)–

    Clearly define the difference between a Peace Officer and a Law Enforcement Officer. Feel free to use anecdotal examples. Extra credit if you are able to objectively identify yourself in one camp or the other and be ready to explain why.

    Do you show up to work looking to champion the DOI and the BOR? or do you see the BOR as an *impediment* to your duty, to be worked around using creative interpretation and contortions of the law? To you– and not just in theory– is it more important to catch the bad guy or respect these principles implicitly?

    Explain the damage done, both tangibly and psychologically, by “officer safety” obsession.

    Acknowledging that there are “bad apples”* amongst you, how many have you arrested? Failing that, what aggressive and affirmative action have you taken to protect the public from them? Would you agree that responsibility, that solemn and sworn duty, is uniquely yours?
    *A “bad apple” is not just the “legal criminal” who’s running an extortion racket or planting evidence (though the brotherhood is frequently enough willfully blind to them too), but I’m just as concerned with the “moral criminal” who might fib about detecting the (nonexistent) smell of alcohol as a pretext to dig deeper to flesh out a hunch.

    I sincerely doubt there’s a “good cop” out there anywhere in active service who could “pass” this exam.

    • I suspect there are indeed some true “good cops” in this country who would “pass” such an exam. As I have said before, however, they only exist in the smallest of agencies, well removed from the hives. And simply being from a small agency does NOT insure they are good, since there is plenty of corruption and treason in small forces across this country as well. Of course, Sipsey and War and Max all swear otherwise…

  8. Asking such questions is asking for trouble. Stay away from them unless you are prepared to go to war (depending on rational responses from bullies is madness). Anyway – getting back to Dale Carnegie – it is counterproductive to pose such questions, even if you don’t end up eating pavement.

  9. Spot on!

    My friend was advertising that stupid cop t shirt today on facebook. I took him to task on it and he would not reply…

    They want people to shut up, not ask questions and just obey….

  10. DWEEZIL THE WEASEL

    It is my understanding that in New Yawk City, traffic cites, minor infractions, misdemeanor arrests, and other chicken s**t violations are way down. It would appear NYPD are either pouting, or running a little bit scared. This is a good thing because the revenue stream generated by the badge-carrying tax collectors is drying up. This will necessitate bureaucratic retrenchment and maybe even some layoffs in the public sector.
    There is something to be learned here. Without firing a shot or getting the Eric Garner memorial award, the general public can demonstrate the ability to control government entities by starving them. Here in the People’s Democratic Socialist Republic of Oregon, there was a “NO” vote on a property tax increase in Josephine County(Grants Pass). The Sheriff had to close the jail except to lodge violent felons. Patrol of the unincorporated areas was cut way back. Subsequent hysterical ballot measures over the past two years(“IT’S FOR OUR CHILDREN’S SAFETY!”) to resurrect the Leviathan have failed.
    There is no Zombie Apocalypse going on and everything is functioning okay. If there was a problem, the local leftist media would have pounced on it. Commissar Kitzhaber has not had to mobilize the Oregon National Guard.
    The upshot of it all is people are beginning to realize how much government at all levels encroaches in their lives. And, as long as they have the power of the ballot box, the ability to starve the Leviathan will be there. Curry County, which adjoins Josephine County, has done the same thing by rebuffing property tax increases and giving the bum’s rush to a local political hack-county commissioner who kept trying to confiscate the peoples’ wealth. Let’s hope this same mindset will surface among the Big Apple electorate.

    • The Big Crapple is a hive. Josephine County is not. Nor is Curry County. Put more simply, the Big Crapple is Blue. Josephine and Curry counties are not. Hive dwellers live Blue because they LUVS them some big government. The Big Crapple electorate will not even remotely consider that mindset until over half of them are dead. And even then…

      And by the way, I fully understand that much of Red America is Rove Republican, and therefor indistinguishable from Blue America.

      • DWEEZIL THE WEASEL

        Mr. Matis: I will concede your point about New Yawk City. It is beyond hope. And, in my A/O we have a huge demographic of Rove Republicans. But, the bottom line will always revolve around money. Money means survival. It means food, shelter, medicine, and clothing. At a certain tipping point, the Leviathan will not be able to steal any more of it. When that will happen is anyone’s guess. But, it will happen.

        • Keep in mind Josephine and Curry Counties got in fiscal trouble because the feds cut them off from the timber dole. But the response was “don’t tax me”. Oregon has no sales tax so you can’t pass the burden on to the tourists. Even Democrats have enough sense to say “don’t tax me”.

  11. “Google” (use your favorite search facility) “John Bad Elk” a case about using force … Even deadly force tho resist unlawful arrest.