Village Praxis: Controlled Pairs vs. NSRs

 
Bill B. publishes an article by John Meyers on truing the way you may need to fight.

Got range time?

As the man says, shoot until you have eliminated the threat.

16 responses to “Village Praxis: Controlled Pairs vs. NSRs

  1. Alfred E. Neuman

    Reblogged this on ETC., ETC., & ETC..

  2. Putting as much emphasis (as possible) on decision-making into a marksmanship program can lead to a much better outcome on the battlefield; avoiding the canned scenarios won’t look as good, but training the mind to handle and quickly solve unexpected (yet realistic) situations is the higher payoff task.

    While “audio-visual demonstrations” on the range may look and sound cool (to some people), they do less towards building the skills required for successful target detection, aquisition, discrimination, and destruction.

    Going to the range to find weaknesses (in abilities, weapons, & equipment) instead of going to the range to showcase well-rehearsed strengths may be a better ideology; it may help to discover and weed-out more “unknowns”.

    Don’t forget to shoot with gas masks….

    • This. Some years ago I headed off a waste of tax money by pointing out group size at distance was largely unimportant, compared to the problem of acquisition, identification, and engagement before it disappeared.

      If ammo is a problem (and even if it isn’t) load one round in your mags and practice reloads from lockback, before moving. Over and over: Reload, roll, 3-5 second rush, down, crawl, engage. Marksmanship, PT and manipulation. The number one cause of stoppages is running out of ammo.

      While I’m at it, the number one cause of “stopping power” is failing to hit the target. See the above paragraph.

  3. The 1-5 drill clearly teaches many useful things but I have always viewed the 1-5 drill as typical for those who come out of of the .gov environment (as near 100% of todays carbine instructors do).
    Why is this relevant? In the .gov environment ammo cost is often not an issue for the firer. Quite the opposite… some tabbed units with huge ammo budgets find themselves with the need to “burn off” lots of ammo before handing it in.. (While many leg infantry units have to count every round as do civilian users) and for this you see folks come up with all sorts of ammo intensive drills and then justify them.. I have no doubt this is the orginal birth of the 1-5 drill
    ….. most users of this forum need to squeeze the maximum amount of training out of every round. Even if you ahve a (by .civ standards) generous training budget of 200+ rds for an afternoon there are many drills that will force you to break firing position or amining point more frequently per round.. re-acquiring targets from changing position ( standing to prone to kneeling etc,
    The 1- 5 drill with its consumption of 15 rds for a single event is a great way to maximize training for the given TIME SPENT in a near unlimited ammo environment… But I submit shooting 15 rds in 3-5 seconds its not a goodway to maximize training for those who have an afternoon and only 100-300 rds to train for that afternoon ( and unless you are in a carbine class) 200-300 rds is at the high end of what most civilian shooters can afford to spend on training in a weekend even if they are serious about training and shoot the most affordable ammo available.

    PS: I myself usually budget 500-700 rds for an afternoon of training but am realistic enough to know that this is an outlier for our community, the reason I mention this is so I get dont a reply like. “Well if you’re SERIOUS you KNOW that such drills are neccessary etc etc”

    • Good post.
      Thats Kyle Lamb running that drill. His times are awesome but he got there because of exactly what you point out. A SIGNIFICANT amount of ammo was expended to develop that time. The other thing that I saw was his ability to stop dead on the target without pushing the muzzle past it and having to come back to the target. Thats also the result of lots of training time and rounds down range.
      The private shooter has to find ways to work around that. That may mean that the standard he demonstrates is not achievable.

      • Guys:
        The drills presented in the article are intended to be PARTS of training regimen’s to train and hone certain skill sets for that shooting day, not the ENTIRE training regimen.

        Per cost. Yes shooting costs money. Developing skills costs money. Taking classes costs money. It involves devoting time to it. But what is your life worth? What is the cost of not being ready?

        If the persons (no one on this thread or in particular, but just in general) complaining about costs have netflix, satelite tv subscriptions, car loans, pizza, beer in the fridge, cigarettes, buys new clothes every month, (hopefully not the designer ones with the holes already ripped in them) eats out more than 1 time per month (yes, Im talking about even the drive through), or whatever other ‘luxuries’ modern Americans have…. I dont want to hear about the cost of ammo or going to the range. You can have what you want if you put your mind to it, it just takes discipline and effort.

        • Understood, regarding drills being parts of a whole.

          I have spent significant amounts of money on training and ammo.
          What I want to make sure is that people are not chasing “standards” that are based on a schedule and logistics supply chain that they cannot match. Especially if you look at this as a single drill that is a building block of a larger skill set.

          I look at this as a time is short equation.
          We have but a few months to get to a level of skill that is serviceable.
          With that time and the amount of ammo that the average shooter can put into the training time there is only so much that can be done. So dont focus on his time, focus on what he is doing.

          Once that time is up and we have done that training, if the political winds allow us more time then we can begin to expand on the base of skills that we have been working on.

    • VW,

      Great post. However, as Lamb explains, the purpose of the 1-5 Drill is to get beyond the “2 is enough” mentality. That is, to develop the habit of pulling the trigger more than twice per bad guy.

      The solution to the amount of ammo needed for this drill and other, inside 75 mtr drills, is to go with .22 long rifle conversion units for one’s ARmalite. The .22 sub-caliber conversion units are amazingly accurate and malfunction-free. Kalashnikov users will just have to burn their 7.62×39.

  4. Because you can’t be too quick to shoot…

    scumbags. one and all…

  5. outlawpatriot

    Certainly. You burn a lot of ammo quickly doing drills like that. I know. I’ve burned a lot of ammo doing drills like that.🙂

  6. wishtheyallcouldbemp35s

    I know they are unobtainium for most, and not really manufactured anymore, but I love my two-stage selective trigger. “One, two, hey, doesn’t seem to be working, brrrrrp, next target”. Don’t have to reach for a selector, just shift the booger hook a bit and pull harder on the bang switch. Takes practice to get good with it, but what doesn’t.

  7. Kyles’ a premier instructor, and a dam good man. I think he spells out clearly what his point is, do what you got to do, with what ever tool your shooting.

    While doing my semi yearly quals a few weeks ago, the RM instructed us to shoot a specific amount of bullets, at a specific point on a target shaped like a man. Sureeeeeeee. Their ammo, when he came over to score me, there were about thirty extra holes in the X ring and head.

    This young, RM, was very indignant, and was attempting to ” school ” me in front of the other retirees, and active folks. When he was finished with his leadership talk and wanted to know my thoughts, I told him this.

    Young man their are no fucking rules In a gun fight, ever.

    The old guys laughed so hard they had tears in their eyes, the swat guys howled that this RM, should have known better then to attempt to school me.

    The RM left the line and called his boss, to tell on me. The boss, called me within minutes and asked that I not be so tough on lil Peter, he was fresh from the academy RM school, and I had caused him a major case of vaginitis.

    Dude clearly needs his vaginal mesh adjusted.

    Fucking pussy.

    I usually get to shoot a couple hundred extra rounds, on there dime, as I seem to throw a round every cycle. Generally from the two yard line.

    If your looking for a carbine class, and your a left coaster, I highly recommend Kyle Lamb classes. Guys Wired tight, an exceptional instructor.

    Dirk

  8. Ammo is cheap, life is irreplaceable…

    I learned about the 1-5 drill and NSR several years ago in a class taught by SWAt instructors. Controlled pair—-> go to NSR if target is methed up or wearing armor and the first pair didn’t convince target to stop fighting. IIRC, it was taught to aim low and zipper the shots up the centerline- idea is that a bullet is likely to find a Piece of CNS to smash or at least find some flesh to bite around armor/obstructions.

  9. interesting discussion/video. But If I hit someone @ <100 yards with 2×168 gr. rounds from an M1a @ c. 3,000 FPs, I think they are going down and staying down. Remember, when the intramurals begin, ammo is going to get scarce in a hurry.