Denninger: Why We’re Doomed


“Healthcare” for Free Shit America will cause a total collapse of the FUSA budget in just a few years.

Accelerated by higher interest rates impacting the outstanding FedGov debt, I’d respectfully add.

If you thought all was going to be OK, think again.

UPDATE 2340E 14JAN2017: Related — Donald Trump promises to slash drug prices by billions, pledging aggressive federal bidding process

We’ll see.

28 responses to “Denninger: Why We’re Doomed

  1. Alfred E. Neuman

    Reblogged this on FOR GOD AND COUNTRY.

  2. Denninger;

    1. In 2012 he said Facebook was a penny stock.

    Wow did he miss that!

    2. He deficated on the Amazon business model.

    Sure got that wrong.

    3. Netflix? “The internet can’t handle the demand!

    Fu&ker is a contrarian indicator if there ever was one.

    Lay off the doom and gloom.

  3. Well he is fu&king right on the point on this one unless you have a problem with basic fifth grade math. And it is not doom and gloom. Go take a look at the increase of Medicare spending on YOY basis. Then come back here and tell us all how that is sustainable.

    • The same algorithm he used at the end of 2008 which erroneously “predicted” TEOTWAWKI is being used to say we’re doomed now.

      Your display of cognitive dissonance is mind-numbing

      • Algorithm? Cognitive Dissonance? As far as I am concerned it is basic math. When was the last time you went to a hospital or ER and saw immigrants wearing burkas or latin american border crossers or inner city welfare moms being refused getting medical care? Who do you think is paying for all this? You know the government is footing the bill for all these people. Do you think they have a $7,000 deductible? It results in a coronary bypass at the Cleveland Clinic costing $300,000 plus for someone in my income range versus $20,000 in other countries from Doctors who trained in the U.S. Do you think those same people you saw in the ER are paying the same price? That is the essence of his point. End of story, I’ll retire to my hole in the ground.

        • You are wasting your time arguing with the ignorant shithead. All you need to know is Detroit is a crime infested ,rotting, disgusting shithole. My insurance premiums went up 19% in 2017. Case fucking closed.

    • Joe,

      Perhaps you should look at the blood, treasure and wealth being expended on unending wars of Amerikan imperialism. In regards to fedgov’s discretionary spending nothing beats the Department of Defense.

      Perhaps you can come back here and tell me how 25 years of incessant war costing several trillion dollars, the occupation of more than 100 countries by the imperialism of the fUSA, and the pouring into fUSA of global poverty, under the guise of “immigration”, is sustainable ?

      Folks like you cannot see the forest for the trees.

    • Denninger is an idiot on this, and using not fifth grade math, but a fifth grade understanding of the subject.

      That is not the same thing.

      Medicare/Medicaid are Ponzi schemes, always were, always will be.
      How much is spent is purely an expression of how stupid thwe Congress is (which is a black hole of unfathomable depth, incapable of measurement with existing instrumentation). So your example is irrelevant.

      Obozocare was designed, explicitly, to destroy private health insurance, and non-governmental healthcare, by absolute express design.
      This is no harder than setting out to wreck a bus by grabbing the steering wheel and yanking hard, at highway speed.

      Pity about the passengers, but they were never important to the goals of the scheme anyways.

      It doesn’t need replacing, it needs eradication.
      People need to be told that if they want healthcare, they can buy any plan from A to Z, with commensurate items covered, and premiums to match.
      Or they can pay cash for services.
      The government’s only job, solely as referee, is to ensure that the prices are not set in collusion, nor jacked up between plans absent actual rationale (i.e. it cost more to deliver rare meds to Nome Alaska by dogsled or to some remote atoll in Guam by outrigger canoe than it does to carry them to the hospital across the street from the plant that makes them).

      Then decide which plan Congress is willing to buy for seniors under that model, and negotiate for some level of group discount, pay their bills – on time, and in full – like everyone else, and call that Medicare/Medicaid.

      Games over, next problem.

  4. On the few occaision’s I’ve actually seen the cost of a specific patient’s care….. I can tell you, it’s terrifying.

    I’m not an MD, just a lowly nurse who has stolen a revered title from the Green Navy, but man! It’s insane! And it just keeps getting MORE expensive. Much thanks to insurance! Ugh!

    Our great friend Denninger nails this one!

    Simply put… unsustainable!


    • You don’t know how much you don’t know about what you’re talking about.

      The only thing actually unsustainable is government interfering with health care.

      No one, when he is sick, asks someone to please call a politician, or a lawyer.
      Everything after that original error is simply gravity doing what it does when you jump off a cliff.

      Mind the rocks at the bottom.

  5. Denninger would know, he voted for Obama and used his site to support him openly in 2008. Never forget that. When people talk about doing necessary things to dangerously useful people, you are talking about Karl Denninger.

    There is not a single thing that I have heard Karl bitch about the last eight years that he didn’t directly cause by his own stupidity. Just like every other Dem voter.

    (And no, McCain was not just as bad and never was contrary to poor Karl’s excuses. The racial hatred/lust for white genocide and hatred of Christians is unique to Barack Hussein Obama).

    • You make valid points about Karl. I have been reading him since he started. But he is also right about the math. There is no way we can keep this up. Do a little reading on medical costs here in the US both now and since say 1940. Then compare those costs with an average from other modern industrial countries. That’s the problem with math. You can’t color it to meet your ideology. Math is what it is.

      • Oh I don’t doubt it and I certainly don’t doubt you (who instantly has more credibility with me than Karl).

        My point, and maybe it was a bit heavy handed, is that we can’t listen to the guy who helped wreck the ship tell us how to fix it. Nor am I willing to forget such betrayals.

        My take on it is that when you look at when healthcare started exceeding “inflation” you will see a strong correlation to collectivization (originally Medicare/Medicaid). Then mandatory treatment laws to force cost sharing on the private side as well.

        If collectivization is the problem how can it be the solution?

        Anyone who voted for Obama in 2008 knew they were giving him (and the Dims) a mandate to further collectivize healthcare, and thus putting a boot on our collective throat. And the math of collectivization certainly doesn’t work because the sum of the pieces together is never more than the sum of the pieces!

        Not to mention collectivists are asking a shrinking number of payers to distribute value to the growing number of non-payers absent any disincentives other than government rationing (even Jonathan Hans Gruber admitted this).

        Yup, Karl says a lot of this same stuff on his blog. After fucking us with Obama.

      • I just finished reading the following article to my husband, as part of our morning ritual…reading aloud to him, that is…after which he suffered a dizzy spell…something that occurs often when his blood pressure spikes.

        No matter KD’s track record, I suspect that we will not be able to sustain the rising costs of health care premiums, and taking a look at the compensation for insurance company CEOs, as well as the quarterly profits reaped by these companies I suspect these are in large part the explanations for those rising costs of basic necessities like insulin and bandages.

        I suggest we all stock, to the best of our abilities, basic, necessary medical supplies and medicines. If the costs continue to rise at the same pace, it will be cheaper to pay the penalty (tax) for not having a healthcare policy than to seek medical attention.

      • “Modern industrial countries” socialized their medical care completely 50 years ago. And they have, and had, confiscatory tax rates in place that make the IRS salivate at the thought, to subsidize those “costs”.
        We won’t even talk about waits for service, or capitation of care under those schemes, just to be sporting.

        You’re trying to compare apples to pineapples as though they were interchangeable.

        Compile a list of actual costs of care delivered from countries with no governmental involvement in health care, and get back to us.
        I’ll read a book while you try and find any.

    • MichiganderJim

      “If collectivization is the problem how can it be the solution?”

      Yep. End of story. I figure it’ll take about 3 years for folk to figure that out. It’s why looters in all corners are already yapping about single payer. They know the sticker shock that’s coming, unless maybe Trump turns himself into a King. Insurance companies are to Republicans what unions are to Democrats.

      The whole thing could conceivably lead to a situation where there’s no viable alternative except totally free markets and abolition of the enslavement of providers.. Challenge there is, it rests on peeps wanting to live and not die, These days that’s a questionable premise.

  6. All of this has been planned, and all of this has been in progress for 50+ years.

    Medicare and Medicaid fraud are almost never investigated, much less exposed. Hospitals bill Medicare $100 for an aspirin tablet and $200 for a Band-Aid, and have made this the “prevailing fee” so that similarly ludicrous fees are sent to insurance companies too–whom the government forces to pay.

    This has been building up and building up to bankrupt the government and bring down the nation for generations. 1970s “baseline budgeting” made the tsunami of debt that’s rising, rise higher and faster.

    You don’t think it was planned? Go look up “Cloward-Piven Strategy.” I’ll wait here.

    George Soros and the Kenyan think that if they crash the economy hard enough, the government will collapse, civil order will collapse, millions of Russian and Chinese paratroopers will descend from the skies to ensure “the right people” are in charge, and the peasantry–at the point of foreign bayonets–will agree to throw out the Constitution and consent to the benevolent rule of people like the Kenyan’s best bud and mentor, Weather Underground terrorist Bill Ayers.

    Go read Ayers’ book “Prairie Fire,” where he fantasizes about “reeducation camps” in Arizona and Alaska to “liquidate” 10% or more of the population, whom he suspects will be “hard-core” and “ineducable” and “irreconcilable” to Scientific Marxist-Leninism. When he wrote this, in 1974, the population was only 250 million, so he was fantasizing gleefully about rounding up and murdering only 25 million Americans then, with the aid of foreign enemies.

    This was planned. PLANNED. And it’s all proceeding according to plan.

    Of course, the alternative is to declare Medicare, Medicaid, and Obamacare unconstitutional under the 10th Amendment, and go back to the free market system we had prior to Lyndon Johnson, then balance the budget and pay off the national debt. Of course, if the courage existed to do things like that, it would have happened at some point in the last fifty years, now, wouldn’t it? If we were ruled by clear-eyed men of good intent, we wouldn’t generation after generation get involved in expensive little wars in which tens of thousands of working-class White men are sent to their deaths and then surrender to our enemies over and over. You’d almost think the people in charge WANTED to destroy the country. You’d almost think the people in charge think working-class White men are worth more dead than alive.

    • Hospital bills Medicare $100 for an aspirin, because the .gov will reimburse them $0.000002 for each one. Six months from now. If they pay the invoice after the fourth submission, and no one at Medicare was drunk, in jail, or on a three month vacation, and their workpile backlog covered by a non-English speaking temp hire from Africa or Trashcanistan, sent over to help from GSA.

  7. The way you keep a game of musical chairs going is to keep playing the music and add back a chair every once in a while. Pyramid schemes like health entitlements and social security work the same way.

    Basic math doesn’t cover this well in the short term time frame that Americans are used to, but there is a way to explain how this works: If you are within the time period that the program is running, you will benefit from it. If you are outside of that time period, you will not benefit from it. It’s that simple. The key is to know when that time period begins and ends. If you are running the program for that time period and know when it will potentially end, you will want to keep the actual inner workings opaque to current and future participants. Such programs can last/benefit generations.

    If I could apply this same technique to a supposed perpetual motion generator without outside scrutiny to discredit its inner workings (or in truth its non-workings), I could make millions. However, that would just be wrong.

  8. Know what is worse than FAKE NEWS? FAKE MATH. Denninger’s lead in is as fake as an Obama promise. Fact his only use case is you just switched insurance companies and then had an accident. If that is the case he is making then then his insurance rates are $ = price of a new car + insurance profit. Reality is ins companies compute probabilities over an extended period of time plus your age and driving record.

    As to health insurance some of what he says is true. But they are second order affects. With Obocare a lot of things were not fixed and some line items were made worse. In the first case Obocare did not attempt to extricate the system from the trial lawyers. In the latter Obocare marginalized a service area even smaller than the statewide model that existed before and never implemented cross state competition.

    If we are comparing models, which seemed Denninger’s MO in this piece he picked the wrong one. Obocare service, pricing and territory is better approximated by the cable industry model that anything else. Consequently the results are similar — crappy service, spotty coverage, outrageous tiering and constantly rising rates YOY

  9. By the way, Leviathan will ditch health care as a issue if it means the difference between peons living or it surviving. That is baked in the cake.

  10. “If you thought all was going to be OK, think again.”
    Second, trump may have put a temp stop in the constant decline and implosion of the medical system blowing up the country; but it’s still coming. too many seniors, welfare people and immigrants of all types will increase costs so much that a serious explosion occurs to the economy if the world debtload doesn’t do it first.
    oh yeah, Obama is still going to fundamentally transform this country and even trump isn’t stopping it.

  11. lastmanstanding

    I come here nearly every day (for years) and appreciate the comments. I just find it hard to spend time commenting anywhere, anymore.

    We always had catastrophic healthcare insurance…until just before ACA came into effect. For wifey and I, less than $300/month for a $10K deductible and a few things. We are both Self Employed and now mid 50’s.

    Always put the $ in the mail, on time, etc., etc. for decades…never had one cent paid in a claim, never filed a claim. Then it jumped to $550/month, $750 month, to $1550.00 within 6 months…for a $12K deductible.

    Wifey deals with hc insurance every day as she is a provider. (Not a doc) We know the system inside and out. She could not find us anything better than that. She couldn’t understand why. No one could answer her questions other than, “you guys make to much money.” I finally told her, “they have to be basing it on what our businesses gross, not our take home pay.” “They can only be looking at that and maybe the (R) at our voting status!” (We have a small home, grow our own food or buy it from a like-minded person within 15 miles of home, can or store it, drive 10 yr. old vehicles and never go on vacation and work 50 plus hours a week. We do our best to support our local community)

    So…we told them to fuck off in the fall of 2012.

    Fast forward to Oct. 2016, find out one of us needs a new hip. So to be brief, we have no insurance, so we need an estimate of what it will cost…$36-40K.

    I do some quick maff, uh huh a! If we had been paying the $1550/month for 4 years = $18,600 per x 4 = $74,400. Don’t forget to add the $12k deductible as well.

    Cocksuckers would have had our $74.4 in advance and we still would have had to pay the $12k. More maff…about $86k. Hard money ladies and gents.

    Final bill was about $32k…quite a spread. Keep your money in your own pocket if you can.

    A few other quick particulars…hip supplies/implant – $12.7K. Surgical suite – $7.8k (Took surgeon less than 30 min to perform task and his fee was only $2.8K, Anesthesiologist $800.) More than fair for what they do. Hospital “fee’s” were the criminal part…totaling about $28k of the costs…for an overnight stay/visit. Took about 10 pills while there…over $1.5K. At pharmacy when released, a months pk’s and mr’s (every 4 hrs/30 days) $36.00. Wtff. Saving those for future!

    Thanks CA for a great site and blessing to all for what is ahead.
    As a good friend of mine always says, “don’t go down without one helluva fight.”

  12. Deninger’s expertise may be finance, but it isn’t healthcare.

    He is either ignorant of, or blindly overlooks, that health care prices have risen exactly to cover the care of the Free Shit Army in question, who pay no bills and carry no insurance.
    Were it not for federal laws that make it nigh impossible to get a fair return for services, or deny care to those unable to afford it (as though health care were an actual right, which it is not, and were a commodity, which it absolutely is), hospitals would price things the way cell phone companies do, and costs would decrease, or services would increase at the same price point (i.e an MRI today delivers orders of magnitude better info than an X-ray in 1950.)
    The reason your hospital-delivered Tylenol costs you $65, is to pay for the 37 bottles of the stuff dispensed to every illegal alien, every indigent homeless waste of skin and oxygen, and every drunken deadbeat unemployed asshole with no insurance they are also forced to see, treat, admit, ad infinitum. If this is news to you, wake the fuck up, and welcome to 2017. Deninger, call your office.

    Simply require people to buy the health care they want, with their own money, and things will shake out to normalcy in about an hour.

    Give the Free Shit Army either V.A. or Tri-care (and incidentally, require the Congress and all fed-gov employees to have the same care plan. PERIOD.) and the happy horseshit in those plans will cease by noon next Tuesday.

    Pre-existing conditions can and should be handled the same way state insurance pools cover drivers who are fuck-ups: they go into an assigned risk pool, and purchase insurance at a higher rate. Or they can go and f*** themselves, and do without. Total personal choice there.

    Cost to the fed-gov: administration costs limited to 10% of the services, and nothing for treatment.

    Problem solved.

  13. Ahhh, medicine… OOPS, better say “healthcare” as medicine makes it sound too much like “doctors” are at the lead! The issue of healthcare as “right” is a good starting point, as this is absolutely ridiculous. Do you have a ‘right’ to food? Water? Shelter? Or do you have the right to PURCHASE or TRADE for such goods? Do you have a ‘right’ to an auto mechanic’s labors? A mortician’s? This is all lunacy. If you want my services, you can hire me just like anyone else does. Now, I may choose to give you my services. I actually do a good bit of that in my work. MY CHOICE!

    Hospitals costs are ridiculous for a variety of reasons. Do not overlook the cost of regulatory compliance. There is a MASSIVE industry in bureaucrats (both public sector and private sector) who are not engaged in productive services, but merely engaging in a circle-jerk to keep each other employed. JCAHO is a massive boondoggle in bureaucratic bs.

    Pedro and family hangin’ out in the ER? Yep! “But you can’t turn them away!” And why not? You are here illegally, why do I have ANY RESPONSIBILITY to a criminal invader?

    Big Pharma: just BOHICA, folks. Looking at the collusion between the and Pharma is boil your blood.

    And what about us peons? Do we have any responsibility? If you choose to smoke cigarettes, you get to bear the long-term consequences of that. PERIOD. Or the 60+% that are obese and out-of-shape? Put down the fork, snowflake! Nah, let’s call it a ‘disability’ and give you a gummint check AND medical care!

    The causes of this are widespread and NOTHING is going to fix it. Just another part of the coming economic collapse. So yes, take care of yourself, eat right & workout. Learn some basics. Don’t go to the doctor unless you are TRULY ILL! Just part of the preparedness paradigm.

  14. Deninger is a doomer who relies upon fantastic predictions of “any day now we’re all going to die” to draw clicks to his website.