Negotiating The Surrender In Afghanistan

The fruits of imperial overreach.

Never forget: the US Army has been fighting a counterinsurgency campaign for an entire generation.

Don’t underestimate their performance when the legions return here for the upcoming North American Serious Misunderstanding.

52 responses to “Negotiating The Surrender In Afghanistan

  1. Alfred E. Neuman

    Reblogged this on FOR GOD AND COUNTRY.

  2. Yeah, but dont forget when they come home they will be facing REAL men, and not boy lovers!

  3. SemperFi, 0321

    I can’t think of a single reason we should leave Afghanistan. It has served it’s purpose well, as cover for a massive drug smuggling and money laundering operation, all under the cover of bringing freedom to the Afghan people. How much money was poured into this op, only to disappear into thousands of unseen cracks. The CIA and MIC thank you profusely, as do untold numbers of your faithful politicians.
    Orwell’s 1984 has proven itself over and over to be a fantastic tactical manual. re: The Neverending War.
    And the idiot masses refuse to see what’s going on under their noses, just like with the Border War. They’ll never wake up, even as the Commies round them up, they’ll still look to the faux media for guidance.

  4. If, as I believe to be the case, American war fighters at the troop level KNOW how badly they’ve been used and abused, and many know that the wars they have been tasked with have been futile… just like Vietnam vets .. how willing do you think most will be to pursue such a war against their own people and within their own country???

    Flag rank maybe, perfumed princes ‘n all, but SFC’s and lower? Not many. And, speaking of “not many,” there are not, and will never be, enough of them to control two or three major city/states gone shit hole, let alone the nation as whole. That it will be impossible and a clearly poor choice as a career, will rapidly become apparent, even to the most morally bankrupt.
    Big Army? Yeah, but highly trained fighting units? Not nearly enough.

    How many deer riflers, let alone Ars are there, again? Can’t beat down goatherders with AKs and ieds? Lots more weapons and abilities here and millions more to use them, once the imperative is clear. Atrocities, shortages, rationing (SHTF list) and the use of our own troops against us will provide crystal clarity. Foreign troops will raise the level of hate and ferocity. Arming muslims and blacks? Just the excuse many are pining for.

    Bring it bitches.

    • are you serious?

      SFC’s and SSG’s live to lord over the lower peons of any persuasion. after-all they have “earned” the right… only true asslickers stay in long enough to get those rockers.. and they sure as fuck are gonna use them. in the coming war, the rocker ranks will be executed on sight- they’ve earned that too.

      “Foreign troops” will wear US uniforms, the Fusan flag, and be worshiped by the murkin masses as Heroes. who would know the dif anyways? with cultural diversity and everything… man, it must really suck to be old and still believe in all the bullshit that was brainwashed into their feeble minds. dirk still thinks nothing has changed on ‘his’ mountain- except for his targets being moved… LOL

      in any case, 99% of the idiot population will obey ‘lawful orders’ and get on the trucks to be re-located to a FEMA Camp, they will also rat out anyone who doesn’t obey the blew-menace and faux war heroes.

    • thesouthwasrght

      Aught, keep in mind the ROE, as they relate to “traditional America”, will be a whole lot less restrictive than they are with the moonscape goatherders.

      • That works both ways.
        And those troops, including the SNCOs and Officers?
        They all have family, somewhere.

        Tough to be a bad ass when you have to pull security just to take your kids out to the bus stop, or wonder whether your house hasn’t been burned down while you were gone, or what happened to your mom and dad and brothers and sisters back in Pigknuckle.

        The military has never had to fight this kind of war, because in the CW and Revolution, there were rules below which no one would descend.

        That reality is no longer operative.
        You start something here now, rules go out the door in 2 seconds.
        And they know that, in their bones.

        100:1 they sit on their hands, and wait for a winner.
        That’s why the only uniforms you’re going to see playing the game will be shirts against skins.

      • Old Gray Wolf

        Ah, well. My ROE will be even less restrictive. Others’ as well. Make life ugly, we can do that too. And will.


      Sir: I can only relate this anecdotal story. It happened to one of my former students who was jerked out of college when his NG unit deployed to Afghanistan. He went over as an E-5. Several E-6’s and above, along with his asshole CO were actually salivating at the fact of being activated, going over, shooting Muzzies, and coming back to get into penis-measuring contests with family, friends and REMFs.
      The futility of the whole enterprise was apparent to this young man. He witnessed staggering amounts of waste and profiteering. He is contemplating writing a book, but I cautioned him about receiving the Michael Hastings Memorial Award. Fortunately he made it back in one piece. If he had to do it over again, I believe he would have worked at a retail establishment and gone to school part-time, rather than take the “tuition money” which almost got him shot.

  5. Don’t underestimate…”

    They are now gutted, with equipment that’s worn out, and with stockpiles of everything important thoroughly depleted.
    They’ve been cannibalizing museum queens for parts to keep a bare minimum of aircraft airworthy.
    They’ve lowered standards (and morale) to sweep out the warfighters, and turn the combat arms into nothing but a giant jobs program for the dregs of society. The military, including the elites, will soon have the same combat capability as the TSA.
    By design.

    The Navy can’t sail a ship without having a collision, the missile forces of the Air Farce are drunk, stupid, and under-qualified, the entire maritime fleet looks like the rustbucket collection of the Hong Kong Garbage Disposal Flotilla, and recruiters times five services need the pink pussyhat and soi-boy contingents just to keep their quotas somewhere close to absolute minimums. Traditional repositories of military males are turning away from the prospect in droves, and every NCO and officer worthy of the title is being ruthlessly culled by the PC butt pirates, with a vengeance.

    The military hasn’t been this hollowed out since 1976, and it’s only going to get worse, not better, for at least another decade, if not in perpetuity.

    We’d be hard-pressed to conquer and hold any five counties along the southern border militarily, and that, with a population largely in favor of the idea.

    In short, it’s impossible to underestimate their performance, because TPTB have been papering over those shortcomings for so long, and so hard, that even they don’t want to know how bad it really is.

    Against anything like a near-peer, for more than 30 days, we’re unlikely to even tie, let alone prevail. And that’s when mushroom clouds start to blossom.

    Bring them back home?
    There are more deer hunters in MI and PA than troops in the entire DoD, and unlike most of the military logistical toothless tail, the deer hunters can nominally shoot. They also have a bench another 47 states deep, whereas the dotMil is a mile wide and an inch deep on talent, and you could fit just about every actual trigger puller from all the services into the Rose Bowl, with room left over.

    The military that went into Iraq and A-stan in 2003 was a shadow of the military that re-took Kuwait in 72 hours in 1991, and what’s been dragged out of Iraq and A-stan is a shadow of what went in. And all of the above, combined, would have been a rump second-rate command in comparison to any theater in WWII.

    When Britain – now Britistan – let their forces get this hollow, they had to contend with the likes of Argentina for the Falklands, purely for pride.

    What we’ll be looking at will be for things a bit more vital than national dignity and bragging rights, and there’s every likelihood we’ll be unequal to those contests, plural.

    Our military is about to become the poster child for the Charlie Sheen “Winning!” meme, writ large, as they follow the same path to total self-destruction.

    Trying to lord it over the locals would merely put them, in about four seconds, into the position of the British garrison on the march back to Boston from Concord bridge, forever. And it would be a short forever.

    They would cease to be a military force in days to weeks, and largely become nothing but a re-supply point for partisans. Everything they count on as a strength would dissipate with every deployment, and disintegrate with every round they fired in anger. They would be, in minutes, about as welcome as fully-uniformed Nazis at a Berlin restaurant in 1946, and enjoy a similar lifespan. People wouldn’t spit on them, they’d shoot them in the face, on sight.

    In a do-over from 1932, the current dotMil would be the rag-tag Bonus Army, and they’d be facing off against 150M+ Americans eager to be rid of them. Every base would be ass-deep in Indian country, their logistics train would cease to exist, and everything they had or received would be sabotaged.

    That would be the shortest war in history.

    It’s impossible to underestimate them in that likelihood, because if anything, I’m probably giving their chances far too rosy an estimate of success.
    And every day they cull the current talent, they bleed irreplaceable experience right out the door, never to be found again.

    The local VFW has more military cred than the current military, even if they’re mostly all sick, lame, overweight, and overage, and you’d still probably get equal if not better PRT/PFT scores at the American Legion than from most basic training platoons.

    Our military, once a source of justifiable national pride, is now mainly an embarrassment.
    Exactly according to plan.

    Turning the legions loose at home would simply do to them what Tet did for the VC: wipe them out and clear them off the decks for good, so the hard-core NVA communists could take over the show.

    • SemperFi, 0321

      “The military hasn’t been this hollowed out since 1976”
      I got out in ’76, we went from 325,000 to under 200,000 while I was in, no money for schools or much else. Yeah, the good old days of budget cuts and recycled pre VN gear. We still had WW2 haversacks and mtn rucks.
      A friend of mine went to A’stan in ’08 with the same Recon company I was in much earlier, he was issued 3 complete sets of varying 782 gear for that deployment. No shortage of money when you’re supporting the CIA.

      • Rucks made in China and Vietnam are cheap; try buying a trained snuffie.
        And how much gear, and how many snuffies, did they leave behind when they returned?
        And how many of the ones who came back were woke as f**k when they returned?
        That’s a hollow that’s going to last for decades.

        • SemperFi, 0321

          Most of the younger combat vets I know have all withdrawn into themselves, they spend a few yrs very silent and not sleeping, dealing with inner demons. Not good.
          They won’t talk to me either, they saw things they won’t discuss, like the corruption and deception over why they went overseas. Very bitter. I think they’re having a hard time admitting they were used and the whole patriotism thing is fake.

      • i went in in ’82

        ronny raygun had plenty of $ then.

        i went to 5 schools and had 2 MOS’s in the first 3 years including an H designator. that made a lot of lifer e-6s and up more than a little bit upset. because of that, the taxpayer is funding my health care and living expenses for the rest of my life, or the end of Fusa- whichever comes first.

        murka! fuck yeah.

    • I hope you’re right, Aesop…I really do.

      we’ll see. While we wait, review this movie for us:

    • “Our military” exists currently ONLY to serve as the
      gladitorial leg-breaking whore for the Rothschilds
      and their corporate/military parasitic colony known
      as ‘israel’ and it’s (((chosenite))) pests.

      And I must offer an apology to whore’s the world
      over – ladies, you’re far more honest and noble
      than ANY of the Rothschilds or their ethnic
      (((chosenite))) shitweasels!!.

      NorthGunner – The Truth Is It’s OWN Defense!

    • Aesop, thanks for that complete explication of that which I merely intimated above. A thorough good job, as usual.

    • How can you write something so good after writing something so dumb two weeks ago?

  6. Afghanistan the grave yard of empires

    Taliban = North Vietnam

    Zalmay Khalilzad = Henery Kissenger

    Afghanistan = South Vietnam

    Taliban Playing the Long Game = Just like the mujahideen did with the Russians from December 1979 to February 1989

    Mujahideen = are the Taliban’s fathers.

    We should have been smart enough not to go in the first place!

    Look’s like a replay of 1975 all over.

    Yes some of us have seen this before.
    It hurts just as much now, as did for us then.

    • Ken you are exactly right. Back in the earlie 80s, I/We had the opportunity to work with a hand full of muja, in the high sierra’s. They were tough, and I thought not very smart.

      My view changed after a third weekend of training. I spent four weekends with them, out of Truckee Ca. 8 days isn’t much, however those of us fortunate enough to train with and learn were impressed.

      Was surprised to learn that our northern Calif Sierra Nevada mountains were very simlar to their mountains.

      Our ” set” stayed in touch for a few years, eventually lost contact. We were sure they were dead or Taliban by then.

      You want to be a guerrilla fighter, learn the patience of them Muja, and the fighting skills of the Apache.


      • I wasn’t honest above. The Afgan/USSR, thing didn’t end until roughly 98. These muji, were transported to Calif, by an orginization name,

        ” The Afghanistan Foundation Inc, Head Quarters is Washington DC. ” still active” check out their web stuff, and see if we come to the same conclusion about who really transported them here.

        our group had come up the mountain from SunnyVille Ca, we worked on Non metallic land mines,solutions in which the Russians were apparently dumping by the millions.

        The guys doing the training, ” cuz that was their mission” had a very difficult time teaching these guys, not to walk trails. Stay away from trails.

        Stay off roads,or alongside roads.

        My group of CMR, troops, had been with these guys for awhile by then, they physically beat into us, stay off the trail. We learned straight up, an angle or straight down. Anywhere except were we would be anticipated.

        All at 7800/8600 ft.

        Good times.

        • “Stay off roads,or alongside roads. ”
          “Stay off roads,or alongside roads. ”
          “Stay off roads,or alongside roads. ”
          “Stay off roads,or alongside roads. ”
          “Stay off roads,or alongside roads. ”
          “Stay off roads,or alongside roads. ”
          “Stay off roads,or alongside roads. ”
          “Stay off roads,or alongside roads. ”
          “Stay off roads,or alongside roads. “

  7. Afghan is not negotiating their surrender, it is the US, negotiating our own departure, a attempt to save face.

    For you war monger’s don’t you worry, boys The South Pacific, Or South America just might present wonderful opportunities, for you and the MIC, and their complicite accomplishes.

    Afgan has never been beaten, those boys are some tough mofos. Respect out. They fucking outright clobbered our military, sadly. We win all the battles, yet they win the war, does that sound vaguely familiar.

    Boys were not their to win, were there for the MIC, to much money being made.


    • @ Dirk

      Re: “Afghan has never been beaten, those boys are some tough mofos. Respect out. They fucking outright clobbered our military, sadly. We win all the battles, yet they win the war, does that sound vaguely familiar.”

      As military theorist William Lind has pointed out many times, the 4th-generation fighter in an occupied country needn’t “win the war” outright in kinetic terms, in order to triumph over his enemies. He only needs to outlast them, the simple reason being that, sooner or later, all occupying armies eventually return home.

      That is, unless the attacking (occupying) nation is willing/able to establish a permanent colonial presence in the territory targeted – something the U.S. has thus far been unwilling to do.

      The hajjis know this, which is why one of their favorite sayings is: “You (meaning the infidels) may have the watches, but we have the time.”

      There were at least two opportune times to leave Afghanistan under favorable terms, both of which were squandered. First, in the immediate year or two after the 9-11-2001 attacks, when the U.S. had hammered the Taliban and Al-Qaeda and they were on the run and in retreat. Second, after the successful mission to terminate Osama Bin Laden.

      Lind and a number of others have recommended that an old but still very effective military stratagem be revived for use in the 21st century against asymmetrical opponents – namely, the raid-in-force. In other words, after some event like 9-11-2001, the appropriate response would have been to hit the enemy as hard and as fast as humanly possible, with overwhelming force. Once the enemy has been broken and defeated in such a manner, you then leave – promising that if you have to return, you won’t be so merciful next time.

      The very worst choice for the invader is to allow itself to be drawn into a prolonged conflict and/or occupation without apparent end – which is exactly what the U.S. did. This plays right into the hands of the enemy, and allows him an ideal environment in which to wage a prolonged asymmetric conflict in which “death by a thousand cuts” can be inflicted upon the invader.

      Lind et al. also return again and again to the military truism that excellent – even superb – performance at the tactical and operational levels of war cannot compensate for a flawed and/or inadequate grand strategy. U.S.& NATO forces may be excellent at the tactical and operational levels, but they are fighting in service of a flawed and weak grand strategy – one utterly divorced from the realities on the ground in places like Afghanistan, as well as larger geopolitical concerns.

      The essential intellectual and moral bankruptcy of our leadership class, civilian and military alike, was exposed when the Bush administration and its advisors termed the conflict “The Global War on Terrorism,” a name which is a non-sequitur. How can one make war upon a technique of warfare, which is what terrorism is? As one conservative noted, declaring war upon terrorism is like declaring WWII in the Pacific a “war on kamikazes.” If your nation’s leaders cannot bring themselves to admit that the country is in a war, or even to identify and name the enemy properly – then that war is probably already lost before the first shots are fired.

      • Lind should be SECDEF. Or at least someone schooled by Lind should be SECDEF. Always going forward

  8. oregon farmer

    “Don’t underestimate their performance when the legions return here for the upcoming North American Serious Misunderstanding.”
    Yeah, their ‘performance” has SUCKED!
    A nation of tribal goatherders running around in flip flops in Winter, armed w 100 year old Mosins and AKs….
    The balance of power HERE will hinge on the National Guards of each state and the cops. Here in OR a resolution is circulating among the many red counties that codifies sheriffs’ DEFIANCE of ANY unconstitutional gun grabbing ‘laws’ at the state level.

    • Oregon farmer, I’ve not heard of this, can you point me in the right direction. My county JUST voted any attempt of county commissioners to meddle in gun stuff, goes directly to We The People.

      Where is this happening, I’d like to have a look.

      Actually down south, here, we really don’t give a hoot what they do, or say. Ain’t nobody going to comply.

      Thanks for the homework tip.



      As a former resident of the Beaver State, I can attest that when I lived there, the Oregon NG could not muster enough personnel to hold and defend a city the size of Grants Pass. That was from a source within the ranks.

    • Never saw a mosin there almost every other type of rifle though aks, sks, mausers, lots of p14s and enfields, tons of martini Henry, hk G3’s, m1 garands, stg 44s, and all types of MGs but never a mosin kinda disappointing since its my last line rifle.

  9. Please understand that the Rules of Engagement for the sandbox(es) are FAR more restrictive than the CURRENT Rules of Engagement for “Law Enforcement” in this country. Our Betters want to “win the hearts and minds” of the ragheads. They have NO such concern in CONUS. And that is NOW, when there is no serious opposition to the warlords. But then undoubtedly those rules will get far more restrictive on the Only Ones when the fun starts, right?

  10. Counterinsurgency is something the Brits ultimately managed to learn about (Malaya), and which the Big Services refused to – it doesn’t make for big contracts, board seats in Corps, and lobbyist positions. FUSA refused to learn it in RVN and again proceeded to clusterfuck everything since early ’02 as soon as they decided that CPT’s and NCO’s (who were doing well) needed promotable O6’s and GO’s on the ground to “unify” things in the name of “jointness” (another word for All Services Are Winners at the Funding Trough). It was already hosed before pussy hats & social experiments were in vogue. From the long-term view of the opposition, as long as you don’t lose, you win.

    The results are already in.

  11. Don’t ever think it won’t happen here. It’s all about control and your place in the food chain. I work with 2 Senior Staff NCO’s, one in the the NG and the other in the USMCR that would enjoy using anybody as a confidence target.

    But even these men have a name and an address.

  12. I seriously doubt that most soldiers (active, reserve and guard) will follow – illegal – orders against the American people. TPTB assume too much. There is some degree of honor that gold will not replace. I’ve met many who would sell themselves or anyone else for coin or glory. I made it a point in my life to stay well away from these types.
    I believe that for most of us here, honor is sacred along with life and liberty.

    I had a dream once – I encountered a killing field, dead combatants of sides I could not tell. It was lightly snowing, but I saw one lone white wild flower poking through the snow and I knew that spring would soon arrive.

    Only the dead have seen the end of war. I pray that we may never engage in armed conflict in any form. The next battle will be here, on our own soil. I cannot even begin to describe the permutations because the “battle lines” will be very fluid and nothing like we have seen before or discussed. It will be very different and not set in any form of combat we have known. Perhaps this is my perception of “worse case scenario” and all I can do is prepare my stores, and my soul as best as I can and pray that God will give me the strength to fight savagely and viciously to defeat any evil and preserve my conscience and soul.

    I cry for my country and what it has become. With God’s help we will prevail.

    This time we are not fighting to fatten anyones bank account, but to preserve that which is sacred. This I will defend.

    • Gd Bless you for all of that, Sir.

    • “Crying won’t help you, praying won’t do you no good”

      burn motherfucker BURN!

      going down… going down now… going down…..

      🙂 300 million 🙂

    • Army has been bringing in tons of African Africans into the combat arms not smart guys but they are strong, can shoot decent, and follow orders plus they enjoy the field and mre s been happening since 2012 til I retired in 2017 so still probably still going on most admitted to being child soldiers. If they don’t mutiny and have decent leaders well you saw the niger ambush video against our best soldiers

  13. I remember passing through Paktia province in 2011 and when I asked what the ruins up on the hill were my team operating in that area told me they were what was left of a fortress built by Alexander the Great. It was on that day I realized people had been trying this crap in that area for over 2,200 years and this wasn’t going to end any different for America.

  14. What many fail to realize is those coming home will eventually be cops and they are the subject of worship by the freedom loving patriotic crowd in this country.

  15. Walter MItty

    You cannot defeat an ideology believed with religious fervor. You cannot defeat the holders of the ideology who are fighting a 4GW. In order to win you would have to kill everyone in the Country above the age of 8 and below the age of 90. The White Russian Army was abandoned. Chiangs’ Army was abandoned. The Communist Russian Army was supplied (by the Allies)after they invaded half of Poland. ( WWII started because of the invasion of Poland by Hitler) (Yea right). I wonder if we will ever really understand what the hell is going on. A certain population group in the United States seem to be dispensable to whom ever is running things. Britain broke the back of the
    Boer resistance by putting the Boer’s Families in concentration camps while the British Soldiers families were safe back in Britain. Once CWII breaks out in ernest , I fear we ( whoever we are ) are going to have to be willing to do some horrible things to win. Whatever winning means .

  16. I don’t think there is any language to define the horror that may unfold.

    Winning ? – last man standing watching the mushroom clouds grow on the horizon.
    Winning ? – we are destined to destroy ourselves.
    Winning ? – surviving with mental and emotional scars.
    Winning ? – losing loved ones and everything you have known.

    There is only one Victory – being received into the Kingdom of Heaven.

    God – I pray the festivities don’t get to be an ugly and unimaginable horror.

    Am I afraid ? – you bet your ass ! But with God’s grace and mercy I will survive and hopefully not become a basket case.