15 Fighters: Shelter

You know the drill.

What do you use for practical shelter from weather?

Specifics, rationale, and links if possible.

Consider not only what your team may need, but also what can be put aside now to help those in the community displaced by the Upcoming Unpleasantness.

74 responses to “15 Fighters: Shelter

  1. 2gosystems.com
    Light, durable, effective thermal barriers.
    Customer service is OUTSTANDING !!!!

    Still a small shop, get em’ while you can.

  2. Poncho.
    Poncho liner.
    Bivy bag.
    Climate-appropriate sleeping gear.
    Done.

    • Community assistance?
      Surplus GP tents.
      Folding cots.
      Foam sleeping pad.
      Wool blankets.
      Done again.

      • “To attempt to set the fundamentals of Judaism and Christianity at odds would be to try and make a man walk after ripping his skeleton out.”

        And yet, both Judaism and Christianity contradict you.

        In rare agreement, Judaism and Christianity agree that they do not have a common origin.

        One proof text:

        “…Judaism and Christianity do not form a common tradition, ‘the Judeo-Christian tradition.’ They are not compatible … only now, for reasons of politics and sociology, have some representatives of Judaism maintained otherwise….”
        Rabbi Jacob Neusner, Jews and Christians: the myth of a common tradition, ISBN 1-586841-08-4, Binghamton NY: Classics in Judaic Studies
        http://books.google.no/books?id=qDdoHV9sPsAC&lpg=PP1&dq=Jews%20and%20Christians%3A%20the%20myth%20of%20a%20common%20tradition&hl=no&pg=PR11#v=onepage&q&f=false

        Many proof texts: http://judaism.is/judeo-christian.html

        • Wow, you found one whole rabbi who thinks Christianity is a cult, and you think your point is proven?
          Well played.

          Almost like…I dunno…like maybe his predecessors would have crucified the blasphemer, Jesus, and hounded his followers.
          Wait, what? Stop the presses. Who knew?

          Unfortunately, the common origin, monotheism, and hundreds of quotes and references to the Torah and Prophets (the Old Testament) contained in the New Testament rather totally undermines that whole preposterous thesis. To put it forth seriously requires a level of religious and historical ignorance and mental incapacity bordering on mental retardation.

          That’s before we get into who all the first Christians were.
          [Hint: not Methodists from Birmingham. Neither in England nor Alabama.]

          What most people think they know about nominally their own religion would fill a thimble, with room left over for a Volkswagen.
          Third time: step away from the topic. Please.
          Peddle that codswallop somewhere else. It’s neither accurate, nor germane here, and merely serves as a pretext for the rabid Joooooooooooooooo!phobia of the tinier minds hereabouts.
          Like further encouragement is needed.

          • Your dishonesty and your ignorance are both showing, but keep bluffing and posing.

            First, your dishonesty.
            “one whole rabbi ” contra “Many proof texts: http://judaism.is/judeo-christian.html
            Hence, not “one,” but “many.”

            Second, your ignorance—in 6 parts.
            (a) Rabbi Jacob Neusner is the most published rabbi of the 20th century. Do you think that is because his scholarship is opposed by the rest of the rabbis? that he is on the fringe?
            (b) Judaism boasts that it follows the Pharisees.*** God Himself pointed out that the Pharisees had departed from the Torah and voided the Mosaic Covenant. Hence, Judaism follows in the Pharisees’ defection and Christianity os NOT derivative of Phariseeism or Pharisaical defection.
            (c) Judaism doesn’t “quote” the Prophets, but disparages them precisely because the Prophets dared to criticize Israel. In the Torah (Torah she b’peh) Moses is treated as a dunce in the back of Rabbi Akiva’s class (Menachot 22b) The Torah also has Isaias sawn in half for having dared to say “I dwell in the midst of a people of unclean lips” (Yebamoth 49b).
            (d) The first Christians left Judaism, hence the first Christian controversy was dealing with the Judaizers. See Galatians 2.
            (e) References to the Written Torah (Torah she bich tav) in the Oral Torah (Talmud, Torah she b’peh) occur in the context of nullifying the Written Torah.
            (f) When you refer to “Torah,” you do not specify which Torah. There are six Torah in Judaism.

            Third, you did not “show your work.”
            Your vague and snarky assertions are not “work.” In the face of your prodigious ignorance about Judaism in general and Torah in particular, you pontificated on Judaism while noting other people’s ignorance. Such hypocrisy is expected of you.

            Fourth, why know-it-all-nothing nurses need physicians. Happily, there are good nurses among us.

            ***a few proof texts:
            “This is not an uncommon impression and one finds it sometimes among Jews as well as Christians – that Judaism is the religion of the Hebrew Bible. It is, of course, a fallacious impression. Judaism is not the religion of the Bible.”
            Rabbi Ben Zion Bokser, Judaism and the Christian Predicament, New York: Alfred A. Knopf, 1967, p.59, 159

            “The Jewish religion as it is today traces its descent, without a break, through all the centuries, from the Pharisees. Their leading ideas and methods found expression in a literature of enormous extent, of which a very great deal is still in existence. The Talmud is the largest and most important single member of that literature, and round it are gathered a number of Midrashim, partly legal (Halachic) and partly works of edification (Haggadic). This literature, in its oldest elements, goes back to a time before the beginning of the Common Era, and comes down into the Middle Ages. Through it all run the lines of thought which were first drawn by the Pharisees, and the study of it is essential for any real understanding of Pharisaism.”
            Universal Jewish Encyclopedia, Vol. 3 pg. 474

            “Pharisaism became Talmudism, Talmudism became Medieval Rabbinism, and Medieval Rabbinism became Modern Rabbinism. But throughout these changes of name, inevitable adaptation of custom, and adjustment of Law, the spirit of the ancient Pharisee survives unaltered.”
            Rabbi Dr. Finkelstein, The Pharisees: The Sociological Background of Their Faith, The Jewish Publication Society of America (1946) p. xxi

            MANY proof texts here: http://judaism.is/torah.html

        • “…In rare agreement, Judaism and Christianity agree that they do not have a common origin….”

          Are you really that ignorant? Or are you just plain stupid?

          • Seems likely a bait from opposing entities to derail the conversation… jokes on them, I’m buying one tomorrow.

          • St.Maur1066

            I’ll take Al’s side on this one. You two are idiots!

            • Better that they both should have remained silent and thought fools, than to have put hand to keyboard thereby removing all doubt.

              Both sides, the Jewish denial of common roots with Christianity and the Christian denial of common roots with Judaism, are thoroughly documented here: http://judaism.is/judeo-christian.html

              A teaser: “From both the Judaic and Christian perspectives, ‘Judeo-Christian’ is an oxymoron in the vein of ‘defector-believer.’ Keep in mind that, as the rabbis freely stipulate, Judaism is a post-Christian religion, hence Christianity preceded Judaism, not vice versa…Consider, the two cases, the Christian perspective and the Judaic perspective.…” Verifiable references are imbedded.

        • And this has what exactly to do with the topic at hand? That’s what I thought…absolutely nothing.

        • Is religion keeping me warm and dry? It has no weight, so it is training.
          Add aerogel poncho tent thermos coffee with yak butter to keep warm.

  3. When it’s -31*F with over 2 ft. of new snow, I’ll stay inside a heated house, wherever that may be, and SURVIVE……….just as the Russian partizans did in WW2.

  4. Jeffery in Alabama

    This works well for me.

  5. Putting myself in a real dire situation as considering shelter, I’m thinking by that point it’s just a matter of choosing wisely where I would choose to shuffle off this mortal coil. For me, defending my home and taking my stand there is my answer for shelter, for if I am to go off into the wild and hunker down in an unknown location without provisions that had to be left behind is probably only prolonging my life a few extra weeks.
    I am not saying this is the way, it’s only my way, as I do not consider myself a wilderness survivor and would prefer taking my (last?) stand surrounded by solid walls and a roof over my head.

    • Tarp is a temporary situation between wall/roof arrangements. You have to keep dry and warm to sleep well and it might be a few days between friendly houses.

    • That’s my plan as well. I’ve got nowhere to run to. The Diversity has occupied the whole planet

  6. ima get a maxV sooper invisible tarp for only $200.

    NOT

    • NIGHTBREAKER

      tFat – they do work , used against FLIR , where I work it was set up and imaged with a pretty high tech system and it SHOWED NO difference with the background , if set up properly (not in contact with your body) it works,
      an Apache Helo could not image thru it . It could buy time in an extreme situation .set up as an overhead cover with bungie cords. a FLIR system also cannot see thru glass. Common sense deployment in a situation where drones may be searching .

      • Not trying to throw flames here, but serious query: How good are these when it’s zero ‘F’ temp and four feet of snow? Even with snow covering the entire package, I’m not sure I’d trust it for concealment from high-tech. But, then, I don’t have any plans to head for the hills. 72 is just too damn old to pretend I’m young an’ tuff anuff to fight off lions and tigers and bears. Still, if the situation arises, an extra 72 hours may be useable.

      • ghostsniper

        “It could buy time in an extreme situation…”

        Why not just get a class 60 tank and avoid all the fuss, I mean, 6″ armor, twin 50’s, 8″ caliber, etc.?

        I mean, you’re talking “extreme” situation, right?

        How in the world do people get this way?

      • Johnny Paratrooper

        FLIR cannot see through a blue tarp.

        But, FLIR works extremely well in all other situations.

        If I bought a night scope, It would be a mounted thermal optic to my Mosin-Nagant or a PSL.

  7. If priorities are lightweight, small size and multiple uses I would choose the US military issue poncho with water resistant bivy sack and self inflating ground pad to cushion against heat loss and to provide comfort. This is a 3 season solution in Virginia. YMMV. Max Velocity advises and sells a shelter that reduces your IR signature, but that ain’t cheap.

    • Just realised I failed to mention a mummy type light weight sleeping bag that will fit in the bivy sack. Many here will state that is what the poncho liner can be used for, though I like a small sleeping bag that is warmer when needed, left when not.

  8. bivvy sack, there, done.

  9. Pup tents(US Shelter half) are heavy. BUT: You can rig them up anywhere you have trees/shrubs, or a flat spot. Unlike poncho shelters. They are very strong when new. They last for decades if given even basic care, and are difficult to tear. Nylon ponchos will get holes in them if you pack them wrong. They are multi- use, and CHEAP!. In the coming festivities it won’t be the newest or coolest thing that gets the job done. It will be the simplest toughest ,old school equipment that keeps you alive. Remember THERE WILL BE NO RESUPPLY . Plan to make do with equipment that you don’t need to replace. Same thing with cooking/eating. A canteen cup and Mess kit sound OLD. But after that case of MRE’s or freeze dry runs out how do YOU plan to eat your beans and rice , or dog and hoe cake? A canteen cup is a great way to boil your water so that you don’t die of the black shits.

    • But doesn’t the GI mess kit suck for the situation you posit? I like the German kit or COTS stuff (no aluminum) for the reason you suggest (forage support).

      • All US mess gear made after 1942 was made of STAINLESS STEEL. All German, .Russian , in general Euro mess gear is made of pure aluminum or plastic. The USGI kit makes a great fry pan and baking pan.(the US Army had a recipe for yeast bread cooked in the coals of a camp fire, or oven, in the USA messkit) The Canteen cup is an almost perfect 750 Ml. boiler. I have European cookers. They are good for making beans , soup and rice. BUT the fry pan is microscopic ,as is the secondary boiler/,”tea cup” They are light enough to stuff a couple of bags of rice into and use the way the Japanese did. and I carry one in each fire team TO&E, Individual can hump the extra if they want to. Another really good stainless boiler can be had from civil war suttlers. It is called a “Muckett” You should look it up. There are a lot of options.

      • Stainless steel chow boiling vessel , or titanium at half the weight and 10x the cost. Aluminum oxide tastes bad, and might be part of Alzheimers parkinsons etc.

    • GI mess kits are shit, the design is well over 100 years old and Never intended to be a cook set. My German mess kit on the other hand is genius tier.

      • @ ensitue WRONG on all counts. The US Army field Manual from the late 1800’s on had entire chapters devoted to cooking with the US Army mess kit(I own several Basic and advanced training manuals from the turn of the 20th century). Basically you don’t know what you are talking about. Field cooking with supplied raw rations was a basic part of US Army training from the 1870’s on until the late 1930’s. Until WW2 all troops were expected to be able to cook field rations using only the supplied mess gear. AND: The German army sucks. That’s why they lost every war they got into for 155 years.

  10. Grenadier1

    This is in my ruck along with 4 aluminum tent pegs.

    https://snugpakusa.com/product.php?id=84

    • When I wore a pickle suit as a much younger man, an air mattress and shelter half were all I needed. Sleeping bag as appropriate for the weather. The old M1950 bag-o-feathers was pretty worthless, but but the newer 3 bag system is great. Slept on the bare sand on Holland DZ in 15 degree weather one night with just the patrol bag. It wasn’t too bad.
      If you can score the new system, you won’t be disappointed. The first time I tried it I was sleeping in a ditch next to a rifle range in low 30s weather and after about an hour in all 3 bags I was sweating like a turkey in an oven.

  11. Cheapest? Walmart heavy duty brown 8×10 tarps. Big enough for 2 people and equipment. Automatic redundancy if everyone has one….

    • Johnny Paratrooper

      People mock Chinamart.

      Literally used to cross the border every day.

      They used to make a camo one too.

    • I am willing to spend to save the weight difference of a basic 8×8 brown green tarp and Aquaquest Defender (pretty sure most expensive tarp). But, a pile of Wal-Mart tarps is pretty cheap and will work fine for broke newbies who arrive young strong hungry.

  12. Wow, the first to comment on a blog topic, woo-hoo!

    I travel around the southeast by car for business. I have been working on my get home kit for a while now trying to make it as light as possible. For shelter I carry a Hammock Bliss hammock with integral bug screen, see https://www.hammockbliss.com/products/no-see-um-no-more. I use an ENO suspension system found here; https://www.eaglesnestoutfittersinc.com/shop/hammock-suspension/atlas-camo-straps/. I string a light weight Aqua Quest waterproof tarp over the hammock, purchased here; https://aquaquestwaterproof.com/pages/tarps. Finally, I use a Titan Emergency sleeping bag when temperature permits; https://www.titansurvival.com/collections/emergency-sleeping-bags and a Wiggy’s Ultralight when it is colder; https://www.wiggys.com/sleeping-bags/by-temperature-rating/20-degrees/

    This set up keeps me off the wet, often swampy ground , its bug free (a big deal in my AO), overhead weather proof and light weight.

    As an aside, I highly recommend Granite Gear compression sacks for your bulky gear. I carry clothes and my Wiggy’s in them and they drastically reduce the volume and are bulletproof.

    • “Wow, the first to comment on a blog topic, woo-hoo!”

      LOL!

      FAIL!

      LOL!

      • When I typed the response I was first in line yet apparently I was not the first to be moderated.

        @tfA-t, frankly, why are you here? CA asked that the comments for this posting provide information for the benefit of those that visit here yet your comment is a childish snicker. I have been reading your comments on this blog for a few years now and again I ask, why are you here? You are like a male version of the crazy, cat lady.

        Oh, and God Bless you.

        • i am an instructor.

          i am here to enlighten and educate.

          my mission is to break the chains that are wrapped around the minds of the unenlightened such as DONK…

          all learning is not by conventional avenues.

          • “… I am an instructor. i am here to enlighten and educate…”

            On how to not do anything correctly… ROFLMBO!

            (Egads,, I’m getting like tFat! LOL– Never gonna happen.)

          • It’s true.

            You are the most vivid example of Who Not To Be and How Not To Act ever seen in human history.

            And for that, you deserve full marks.
            Never mind that you’re always in the middle of the punchbowl: float on, brave turd!

          • Johnny Paratroopers

            tFa-t is Right.

            Most learning is non-typical or atypical.

            Lessons are learned by any means.

            His “sucker punch” approach is good training.

            Taking a hit is important.

    • Donk,gotta say the emergency sleeping bag seems like a winner space/weight wise,you ever sleep in one and with a little care is it more then a one shot deal?

  13. 3 items used in whatever combo situations dictate:
    * Poncho that had been discussed earlier. In a pinch can serve as temporary shelter till other arrangements can be made.
    * Space blanket for heat retention if conditions warrant.
    * 4mil plastic sheet, 8×12, or 12×12′. Flimsy as all get out but it is to be used as the water repellent under layer to whatever lean-to assembly that can be cobbled together using local materials. Use an over story of boughs, branches, etc to dampen the forces on the plastic. And yes after a while it becomes useless.

    The whole kit is under 5#. If I plan an extended hike I take this with me always. Have deployed this twice. Other than the poncho the balance is a throwaway. If one is lucky the plastic and blanket might last a week in continuous use.

  14. Old Gray Wolf

    ^^^ This is how I roll, also. Northern latitudes and higher elevations may require more. A proper size Kifaru tipi and folding wood stove are fine shelter for those areas.

    For more long term community shelters, dugouts or wigwams work great. Wall tents too, with sheepherder stoves if stealth is not required. Or use abandoned buildings if available. Shelter is pretty attainable for a person capable of more than fogging a mirror…

  15. Poncho or lightweight canvas (much quieter than synthetic) fabric painter’s cloth over a hammock. Deep south terrain, very rarely snows and the sun is the real enemy so a cover over thorny growth with stinging insects and poisonous snakes is what the rurals offer. So I have to make do with what I have.

    The poncho is more multi-purpose, but in a driving rain, isn’t all that ‘weather-pruf’ like the tarp is. Still trying to figure out the sweet spot as far as tarp size goes, but a 8′ x 8′ square has proven to be very versatile. Corner to corner with a line over the hammock works well. Keep bungee cords attached to tarp grommets, along with 8″ aluminum spikes to drive into ground. Unless the ground is very sandy, these spikes hold just fine.

    The hammock with a bivy sack, woobie will take care of me to just above freezing temperatures. I sometimes wish a 2nd woobie under the hammock for dead air insulation was around though.

    Good question – looking forward to more answers below.

  16. NightBreaker

    • Ser,according to site 64″X56″,6 mill is a tough bag and can take a lot of abuse,as a builder have used em for decades.

    • 56 x 64 ” when flat. Double width or length by cutting bag. This was a camping staple for my troop in mid 1970s. Keeps stuff dry in PNW semi rain forest in your pack or in tent.

  17. Yes, buy lowest bid gear. That will work out….

    • Spoken like an Army Of One.

      So, this series has been running for weeks.
      Did you just notice?

    • Bad Attitude

      From the first of the “15 Fighters” series, which was on knives, the question presented was “[W]hat would you get if you need to equip 14-15 fighters.” This is not a question about what would I buy for myself with an unlimited budget, this is a question about what equipment provides the best bang for the buck if I am buying in quantity.

      I have personally enjoyed this series and learned from the discussions about the pros and cons of various products and the perspectives of various contributors to these discussions. Thank you all.

    • Not all cheapest stuff, but if you need 60 of something for 15 guys, that may be only option. Multi use things that are wear out disposable items ought to be cheap so you can get lots.

  18. Three questions I’d ask: 1) How long a stay? 2) What are the weather conditions? 3) Single occupancy, double? or more?

    I’ve used the same Eureka Timberline since the 70s in many areas of the country for extended periods of time, mostly in the BWCA and SNF, in all weather (honeymoon spent in BWCA in January). Still in decent condition. I’ve heard newer versions aren’t so tough due to flimsier material. Roomy for two and larger sizes are available.

    I’ve used Milsurp shelter halves and tarps and canvas coverings, have always found them lacking, especially in the comfort zone. And let’s face it: if you’re a normal human and can’t sleep comfortably, you’re not going to perform optimally. Period.

    If I had it to do over again, I’d probably opt for a Teepee type that will shed snow and water better. Regardless, always put a plastic ground cloth under the tent. If you live in skeeter/critter country, better make sure there is netting at openings and a floor: you do not want to waken covered in bug bites, period.

  19. it must be nice living in the south where real cold doesn’t exist, guess that is why there was a season for war. i’m thinking a barn full of straw and hay bales would be better and hope. the new york swamp, doesn ‘t burn you out. in the early spring or late fall through winter.

    bush c raft something makes afforable tarps. i’m thinking 10×10 is about right. i can sleep on the g round of hang it over a hammock diagonally. gets some krylon and dirty up the blank space.i’ve tried hex tarps and they just don’t work great , squarehas so many better options. last summer, we had inches of rain every week, you could of drowned, on the ground.

    does anybody have a link for really good ponchos?

  20. John Stevens

    I prefer the hammock set up as well strictly for the fact that it keeps me off the ground and away from snakes. I bought a $40 Walmart hammock with a built-in bug screen and it sleeps better than my ENO hammock.
    I use a nylon tarp that I bought at REI (who will never get another dime of my money). I have also done the US sleep system with the bivy sack and foam pad on the ground with a tarp and it works fine also.

  21. ghostsniper

    Depends on the mission, as with all gear, always.

    A day or 2 out, on a raid or recon, where speed is essential?
    Like Aesop said, poncho, maybe a liner, nothing fancy, just fast and light, it’s not meant to be the Holiday Inn.

    A week or two, mostly stationary? A pair of 12’x12′ dark tarps and a spool of decent cordage, sleeping bag, maybe a blanket. Your back strength is your limit.

    A month or more? Now we’re talking tools rather than shelter cause you’re going to build most of it with things found on the site. A couple large tarps would come in handy.

    In all of these things you really have to consider the point of being out there in the first place. To do otherwise is pissing up a rope and a waste of time.

  22. My take? I look at shelter and kits in layers. Heavy camp, medium camp, light camp and this sucks. Something like that.

    Heavy, an Army Crew Tent with a Yukon stove. I made something to hold a tarp over the vents, that’s the crew tents weakness, water gets through the vents. What I did was get a Styrofoam faucet cover, run a tent pole though it and strap a canvas tarp over it. That keeps the vents free and covered.
    It’s heavy and takes up space, but, it’s roomy for a couple of people and can conceal light. Keep the rain off of the vents and you’ll be dry.
    https://www.military-tent.com/4mencrewtent.html

    I have a Marine Combat Tent. It would be nice to stick a Yukon Stove in it. But, I digress…Still heavy, nearly 9lbs, but it’s a two man tent. Break it into a two man carry. Cache it or keep it in a truck.
    https://www.military-tent.com/euusmaco2man.html

    Both are made to Mil Spec. Subdued i not camouflaged, rather weather tight and dark. I’ve ran a Coleman lantern in my crew tent and it did not shine through. The Combat tent, lets some though under the rain fly, but it conceals pretty good. This also makes it easier to sleep during the dayas well. Both are IR resistant, have two doors, can take a snow load, the crew tent more so and it can be a hot tent. I’ve seen a guy on YT with 4″ of snow on a Combat Tent. I’ve failed to set mine up in a snow. I have slept in 35MPH gusts on a mountain top in mine before. Held up fine.

    Then a tarp shelter, Marine Survival Tarp or a GI poncho. I’ve not sprung the money but one of these would be nice.
    http://store.oldgrouch.biz/ulsita8.html

    I have ULCANS camo nets to fit any of them.
    http://store.oldgrouch.biz/ulcanelasi.html

    Sucks, Bivy sack for an Army sleeping bag with a patrol bag, full system or a poncho liner. You’ll be fine.

    Summer time use a static V mat, winter, Thermorest Scout. I have a Thermorest that has an R4 rating. With the crew tent, you can have a blow up full size mattress. But, insulate between it and the ground. When I was in my 20s, I sneered at them. Not now…

    I’m currently working on an idea of a large tarp set up for camp kitchen.
    This is situation dependent, of course. Have options. Tents can be burdensome, and a false sense of security but also you can get better rest in them and be better shielded from the elements. A tarp shelter can sometimes tak as long to set up and still not shield you from the elements, but maybe enough and offer some concealment. All of these shine when wet though. No matter what you have, be prepared to mitigate the downside.

  23. Johnny Paratrooper

    I tend to stick with all the basics. Anyone who has slept in the field for extended periods knows the game.

    Bugs can be an issue. Another comment mentioned he had awful bugs in the swamp. It should be known that areas like Virginia or Maryland can be Farmland with steady winds, dense forest, or fern and vine fresh water swamps or salt water swamps full of reeds. (FYI, Saltwater will mess up your guns)

    I like to keep a waterproof base or tarp just for the ground, especially when things a squishy.

    “Tent City” is the saying for a reason.

    There are good arguments for keeping a sheet of heavy mil clear plastic.
    (Rain Collection, Repairs, Redundant)

    Test to make sure whatever you buy can be repaired with duct tape.

    In reality, I have spent many a night sleeping just next to my pack. Sitting on my ground cover with my mosquito boonie on.

    Gortex it a miracle textile. If you by any article of clothing with Gortex, it should be shoes and pants. You can get away with the “cheap out” on a military grade poncho, commercial rain gear, or “brand name” rain jacket.

    I never considered a mess kit outside of a double Stainless Steel canteen cup as an imperative. I would carry an extra magazine over a complete kit. But a commercial grade shallow 2 quart chaffing dish(Stainless Steel) works great. You can use your Gerber as a handle.

  24. (((Doc B)))

    I have been using homesewn hammock and tarp kit for some time. If you look around on line you can find decent instructions to make some first class kit for a good price. You can make gear exactly the way you want it….in exactly the colors you want. Often for cheaper than you can buy it.
    My Hammock, quilts, and tarp are less than 250 dollars and I have slept comfortably down to the low twenties. The entire setup also takes up less space than a tent. I know for a fact that gear can me made cheaply that will work to twenty below.

    Check out http://www.ripstopbytheroll.com for bits and shit.

    I am willing to help anyone who wants it.

  25. OathKeeper

    I am starting to like you a lot. You have a weird handle but, you write the best stuff. I’d like to sleep there too.

  26. Take Moseby’s advice. Travel light, freeze at night. Poncho, liner, tarp.