Aesop: Range Report I – Ruger PC9 Carbine

Enjoy.

30 responses to “Aesop: Range Report I – Ruger PC9 Carbine

  1. robroysimmons

    I’m glad our buddy Aesop took time off from starching his cammies to review this. Years ago I would have said range toy, but these days the 9mm carbines fill a defensive niche.

    To keep this positive to put Grovtec QD swivel sockets on a plastic stock is easy, so easy that I was able to do it and my handy skills are only slightly above average. Grovtecs being steel and of high quality not the aluminum probably China sabotage quality QD sling gear.

    • Please explain the niche of this 7-pound Glock.

      • Johnny Paratrooper

        Explain 40 years of Germans using the fucking 9mm you cunt.

        God Bless. And the world for nearly 100.

        Also, The 9mm Fucks inside of 200 meters.

        If you think shooting someone with a 9mm at 100 yards is ridiculous, but you think 400-800 yards on a .308 bolt gun makes sense, then your head is on backwards.

        • …and the 7-pound 9x19mm does something the 1.5-pound 9x19mm doesn’t? 5.5 pounds gains you some sight-radius and 100fps?

          If one lugs around 7-pounds, a 5.56 NATO, 7.62 NATO, .300BLK, 6.5 Grendel, 9x39mm, or 6.8 SPC makes sense.

          A 7-pound 9x19mm, not so much.

      • Jackdaddy63

        PC Carbine would be great for allies (e.g. spouse, kids, neighbors) not familiar with AR platform. Shares common 9mm ammo with pistols, but gives user ability to reach out 100 yards. It’s also not as scary looking, although the new PC Carbine with the M-loc fore end is getting there.

      • Uses all the same magazines as your 2 pound 9mm Glock (17/19/26/etc.).
        Including the Glock OEM 33-rd happysticks.
        Including the aftermarket 50- and 100-round drums.
        Breaks down into small backpack-size components in about 3 seconds.
        Turns a 30Y round into a 200Y round.
        Has the ability to mount a suppressor can, and fire subsonic 9mm rounds.
        So let me think, a small shoulder weapon, with 33-100 rounds of suppressed fire without reloading, at 200yards, that would fit in a small backpack a few seconds later.
        Or do the same thing inside the hallway of your apartment building or out the front window of your house during civil unpleasantness.
        That’s available for about the same price as a bare-bones AR, or a new Glock pistol.
        Hmm.
        You’re a bright guy, Al, see if you can figure it out from that all on your own.

        • “Uses all the same magazines as your 2 pound 9mm Glock (17/19/26/etc.).Including the Glock OEM 33-rd happysticks.”
          Close, but no cigar—the same as a 1.5 pound Glock 43. Gaining exactly what?

          “Including the aftermarket 50- and 100-round drums.”
          —the same as a 1.5 pound Glock 43. Gaining exactly what?

          “Breaks down into small backpack-size components in about 3 seconds.”
          A 1.5 pound Glock 43 requires no “breaking down,” no backpack, fits in a pocket.

          “Turns a 30Y round into a 200Y round.”
          Tell us another funny one. Next you’ll be bragging about how long your… barrel… is. The ability to get hits with either the 1.5-pound or 7-pound, doesn’t make the 9x19mm “a 200Y round.”

          “Has the ability to mount a suppressor can, and fire subsonic 9mm rounds”
          —the same as a 1.5 pound Glock 43. Gaining exactly what? Not sure what you mean by the redundancy “suppressor can.”

          “So let me think, a small shoulder weapon, with 33-100 rounds of suppressed fire without reloading, at 200yards, that would fit in a small backpack a few seconds later.”
          —the same as a 1.5 pound Glock 43. Except that a G43 with Gemtech Aurora II or Thompson Machine Poseidon still fits in a pocket, no break down or backpack required. Gaining exactly what?

          “Or do the same thing inside the hallway of your apartment building or out the front window of your house during civil unpleasantness.”
          —the same as a 1.5 pound Glock 43 and much less than a 7-pound AR of any rifle chambering. Gaining exactly what?

          That’s available for about the same price as a bare-bones AR, or a new Glock pistol.
          —the same as a 1.5 pound Glock 43. Gaining exactly what?

          Answer: You gain 5.5 pounds.

          “Hmm. You’re a bright guy, Al,”
          —Well, thank you.

          “…see if you can figure it out from that all on your own.”

          Here’s what I figured out all on my own:

          The 7-pound 9x19mm gains you some sight-radius and some velocity, but doesn’t come close to the effectiveness of other 7-pound choices that are approximately the same price.

          The 5.5 pounds are a NET LOSS, precisely my original point.

          • Addendum:

            To use the double stack 9mm mags, we actually do have to use a 2-pound Glock.

            So…

            Answer: You gain 5 to 5.5 pounds depending on which Glock you use.

            • Thanks for sparing me the trouble of spanking you on that obvious point.

              I’m off to the outdoor range tomorrow or Saturday.
              Just for you, I’ll be sure and try some rounds at the 200Y line.

              You try your G43 pistol at 200Y, and we can compare our targets afterwards.
              Shall we call it $1 a point, or would you prefer to quit while you’re only behind in style points?

              Your ball.

              Militaries and police agencies, not to mention private citizens, have found utility in pistol-caliber carbines going back at least 100 years.

              Of course, we’ll grant that you’re a special case, and will never, in your entire lifetime, have any need of any such thing, nor face any such circumstances where it might be handy to have one.

              So…don’t buy one.
              DILLIGAF?
              I’m making zip and nada from Ruger nor anyone else, so I couldn’t care less what you buy or shoot.

              The review was intended for those interested.
              If you’re not thusly inclined, don’t let the door hit you in the ass on your way out.
              We’ll both be happier all around, and you’ll likely be much less butthurt.

      • “Please explain the niche of this 7-pound Glock.”

        I kind of see your point. I figure it’s like this:

        #1 Less recoil and easier to shoot accurately (rifle vs handgun).

        #2 The Ruger PC9 Carbine has a 16″ barrel vs the Glock 17 has a 4.5″ barrel length – increased velocity makes for better terminal ballistics and accuracy of the 9x19mm round in situations where the longer length of the carbine doesn’t hamper ability to employ it and you are somewhat beyond the practical handgun range for most people.

        https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ruger_Police_Carbine

        The Germans did pretty well with their MP 38/40 9mm sub-machine guns in WW2:

        Even if not full auto a semi auto carbine spitting out rounds from a 17 round or so magazine is going to be pretty effective at intermediate ranges. I can see someone carrying a Ruger or Glock 9mm pistol on their person in case of an armed attack by one person and also having a 9mm carbine in the trunk in case of a riot or some such situation where you would really need to suddenly to serve up some hot 9mm appetizers to a whole crowd of angry people. 🙂

        The Ruger PC9 Carbine looks to be a quality and good looking firearm:

        https://www.budsgunshop.com/catalog/product_info.php/products_id/56184/Ruger+PC+CARBINE+9MM+16.12+TD+TB%2FFLUTED+17RD

        However, if it were me for the $500 for the I would just build another AR:

        PSA 16″ 5.56 NATO 1/7 M4 Nitride Classic Gray Freedom Upper – With BCG & CH – 5165447990 $ 219.99

        https://palmettostatearmory.com/psa-16-5-56-nato-1-7-m4-nitride-classic-gray-freedom-upper-with-bcg-ch-5165447990.html

        PSA AR15 Complete Classic Stealth Lower $129.99

        https://palmettostatearmory.com/psa-ar15-complete-classic-stealth-lower.html

        Magpul MBUS Gen 2 Flip-Up Rear Sight AR-15 Polymer $55.05

        https://www.midwayusa.com/product/2319289991/magpul-mbus-gen-2-flip-up-rear-sight-ar-15-polymer

        Magpul PMAG 30 5.56x45mm Magazine, Black (30 Round Capacity) – MAG571-BLK $ 12.30

        https://palmettostatearmory.com/magpul-pmag-30-5-56×45-magazine-mag571-blk.html

        D&H 5.56 30rd Aluminum Magazine $ 7.99

        https://palmettostatearmory.com/d-h-5-56-30rd-aluminum-magazine-8416.html

    • Cammies don’t get starched, rob. 😉
      OD pickle suits mebbe, but that’s an Army thing.

      And thanks for the tip on the Grovtec swivels. I’ll check into ’em.

      The problem in this case wasn’t with Uncle Mike’s, it was with the bonehead flunkies at Ruger who screwed the pooch at both ends on this one, per the review.
      That’s just union employee level of sloppiness, and engineering desk laziness. Total inattention to detail in both cases.

  2. Thanks for the report. I respond here out of frustration with Captcha bot filters using Tor.

    I opted to use G26 mags, for minimum profile.
    Provide one seats a loaded magazine firmly in place, they work just fine.
    (So do G19 and G17 mags.)
    If you don’t check it, you’ll find the magazine now with nine rounds sitting under the weapon after your first shot jiggles it loose.

    So seating and pulling down as a tactile check of positive magazine catch engagement per the manual of arms on an AR doesn’t work? And if one omits this step under stress, it could result in a double feed?

    Did this happen with the Ruger mags that came with the piece?

    • As i explained, slapping into place firmly, and pulling to check seating absolutely works.
      Except the one time you don’t do that.

      And the same is true of the Ruger magazines, which are also generally spendier, and far less ubiquitous, (and made of unobtanium, if/when Ruger management chooses to go full-Fudd again anytime soon, just as old Bill Sr. did once), not to mention incompatible with anything else, unlike the Glock 9mm sticks, of which I probably have a footlocker-full.
      Game, set, match.

      • When you get to 2,000 rounds, let us know how the parts look, accuracy changes, tightness of fit on the two major assemblies, i.e., whether or not it’s a piece of shit. Most commerical -grade guns these days don’t hold up to a good punish fuck.

        BTW I’ve had good luck with Ruger products less Quality Control on assembly with one revolver. But they did honor their warranty no problem.

        • Grey Ghost

          Agreed. I had a QC issue with a Ruger Rifle a few years back. THEY fixed it and honored the warranty but I was out the rifle for a month. Shot pretty good after they fixed it. I eventually got rid of it for a lights out bolt gun.

          /r
          Grey Ghost

        • Unless Ruger wants to donate a sacrificial gun, and one of the white box ammo companies wants to spot me the 2K rounds, I can’t see beating the shit out of a weapon just because I can, and pissing away $1000-1500 in the bargain.

          If I put 2K rounds through this thing, it’ll be because I had to, and at that point, posting is liable to be rather sparse.

          The only exception would be if I took a paid tac carbine course from someone, and if that happens, I’ll post the update.
          As I cannot remember having ever paying for any firearms training in my life (NTTAWWDT), I wouldn’t be holding my breath in that respect.
          Unless the powerball kicks in big time.

  3. I’ve owned and used several carbines, they do fill a role but my current AO is not carbine friendly (556 & 762 are necessary as the tree line is 1000 yards from my front door). I wish the owners of all such PCCs luck but they are not for me.

  4. Sold me in a number of respects not the least being minimal recoil.
    Geezer friendly.

  5. It is difficult for me to understand that a modern 9mm carbine weighs close to 8 pounds and a M1 Carbine designed 70 years ago weighs in at a little over 5 pounds.

    • It’s all the airbags, crumple zones, and the Windows PC screen you’re not supposed to look at while you shoot. Bangs per gallon went down proportional to weight gain.

    • M1 carbine is locked breech. Ruger carbine is blow back, so breech block is MUCH heavier M1 bolt.

  6. Alfred E. Neuman

    Reblogged this on FOR GOD AND COUNTRY.

  7. The 5.7×28 pistol cartridge is a game changer. With the right grain bullets vest punchers. Carbine length works well for a couple in our group. Great Varmiter . Pistols a legit 100y capable unit.

    If it’s what you have, make it work. Being in California, those guys are running out of options. With the bullet selections for those calibers today, even the 9mm is a potent stopper.

    Good review.

    Dirk

  8. Got a Kel-tec sub 2000 a few months ago. Went to the range with some relatives-just socializing really. Shot about 250 rounds without any problems at all. 15 rounds mag dumps were 6” horizontal ovals at 20 yards. Weird, I’d expect it to string vertically.
    4 people shot it, the 2 skinny guys said that the recoil was irritating to their cheek weld.
    I don’t know what it weighs – not much. Folds over and goes in a totally innocent looking book bag. 450$.
    It’ll take more shooting for me to be completely comfortable with the thing, but I’d say it’s a legit weapon for house fighting.

  9. Jimmy the Saint

    I’ve got one of them. Nice little thing to bring along for camping and such, plus useful to hand to a trusted friend in the event of Rodney King Festivities 2.0.

  10. Oldltradesman

    Credit where due: Aesop’s review was excellent.

    This morning I forwarded the review to a white coworker, 50ish, in a single- wage earner marriage, and fairly new to gunslinging. He was afraid of firearms in the past, and felt that using them against another human being was immoral due to Jeeboo reasons.

    He is worried about the upcoming elections and anticipates the need for something reliable, but relatively inexpensive. He realizes the election outcome is irrelevant. Several hours after reading A’s review he excitedly informed me that he intends to invest his tax return in the carbine along with several thousand rounds of ammo. Wow! We’ll see if he follows through.

    I’ve recommended the PC Carbine to my coworker in the past, along with the Security 9. Took him & his females to ranges several times to undergo the fam firing of assorted weapons. The women confidently handled the PC and Security 9.

    The PC carbine is not what I would choose. However, it works for people like my coworker. In my view, it’s far better than nothing at all.